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Multi Fin Confusion.
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gemoore



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jingebritsen wrote:
I tend to sail really powered so, I tend to like a larger single fin. Others like to sail less powered and are convinced that more fins are better? Dunno if that applies to you or not.

Have tried multi fins and am not that interested, but the 2011 Exocet long boards now have that option. I've rarely skipped out of any bottom turns or needed more grip than what I've had for the past 3 years....


Compared to my sailing pals, I underperform quite a bit when lightly powered, but rule when overpowered to the limit. I'm not sure why, as I've tried to get better in the fluffy wind with little improvement. It's not at all atypical for others to be on 4.5's while I'm still on my 6.3 (which is a forgiving as heck SuperFreak, but the point remains because it was true before I converted to Hot Sails....and I'm only 75 kg so it's not like I "need" power). I like having excess power to bleed off, not hoping there's enough to get through a move. And it's not because I'm inefficient, as I can usually plane on smaller gear than the vast majority of sailors. My timing and read of the wind just isn't as good in light air.

But I'm new to this longboard surfing thing, and mainly wonder if multifins help crank it around better when surfing a wave. Otherwise, the lower cost and simplicity of a single fin is appealing.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think multi's allow for a tighter or better turn. The intentions from surfing have always been to grip better in steeper waves. Again, the grip thing has rarely been a problem for me in humble FL surf. I tend to like the slide on some cut backs, when expected that is....

Fin more forward in an A box slot allows for tighter turns and more planing power: nice.

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And, of course, hull shape is most critical. Speed, turning, ride quality, planing power, pointing, etc. are first and foremost driven by hull shape, then tweaked by fin choice. (That's a very big tweak, but it's still a tweak; an upright blade fin is still going to get a rockered-out wave board upwind far behind a slalom board, for example.)

Mike \m/
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 5467
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With a "high performance" longboard, the 2 + 1 fin setup is utilized to make the board turn "more like a shortboard."
Single fin longboards are generally made for more traditional style (ie. cruising, noseriding, footwork) longboarding.


surf board stuff

The four fin is more positive and has more drive and projection out of turns than a twin because it has more fin area in the water. The four fin is looser and goes edge to edge quicker than the tri fin because the center fin on the tri fin always remains in the water


more surf board stuff


the multi fins won't gain speed or plane as quickly, but turn much sharper

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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Living the life on the beach, I've been there done that.
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gemoore



Joined: 14 May 2001
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had presumed that more fins "grip" the wave better. And therefore might turn better, and of course be slower.

In part, slower seems likely due to the fins having toe-in, but toe-in should help turning since this creates differences in the radius of curvature for the arc that each fin travels (much the way front wheels do on a car, but of course with much less grip than a car).

Because our lake swells are small, weak and tightly coupled, it seems to me that a multifin might facilitate staying with these type of waves, and making the bottom turn in a narrow trough.

I think this is precisely why the Aero 117 is nice for moderate-wind big lake sailing - the short wide wave-rocker planform makes it easy to turn in a tight space, stay planing (but not particularly fast), and yet ride some slow mushy waves. So I agree with isobars on the role of the hull.

The question is whether or not converting the K 11'5" to a tri-fin would be worth it. The better the board in its native format, the less likely I am to mess with it....it's why I'm happy to experiment with the Pacifico Wave by adding some Pro-Box fins. To me the PW is an average quality board, rides OK, but is an entry-level board. The K 11'5", however, is by all accounts a really fine ride and messing with it is more likely to mess it up than enhance it....unless there is some reason / prior experiment that helps us know for sure that it's a good idea.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Darn near any moderate-to-small board -- say, under 120-130 liters, maybe bigger -- will crank hard/tight turns if properly commanded to do so. Depress the lee rail, pull the back foot windward, pull hard with the back hand, and drive the mast forward and leeward, and any ordinary WS board is gonna crank out a tight turn. How far into that menu a sailor must progress in order to turn hard varies with the board and fin; many require no more than a big toe twitch.

Mike \m/
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gemoore



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We're talking about the Kona 11'5" - a longboard.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Read the thread's topic and original post.
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gemoore



Joined: 14 May 2001
Posts: 494

PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps it would have been better to note that the "we" in my last post is referring to a side-bar discussion, in which I'm asking Mr Ingebritsen a specific topic on which his expertise exceeds everyone else I know of - to wit, the Kona 11'5".
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