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Long or short harness lines
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 757

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would you say it's easier to do one
-handed jumps? How about hooked in backloops?
How about driving the board forward downwind to plane while hooked in?
I still benefit from unhooking to get the earliest planing but only do that if very very light for my sail size (almost never). Obviously being around waves we unhook and hook in all the time but so are other riders using super short (18"!!!!) lines.

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 18534

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

manuel wrote:
Obviously being around waves we unhook and hook in all the time but so are other riders using super short (18"!!!!) lines.

Another choice, much of the time. Roller bars allow a great deal of maneuverability and a FULL range of point of sail while letting the harness bear the load ... IF the arms are not fully extended when hooked in.
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 322
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are tired forearms and tired hands a sign that perhaps your lines are TOO long? I find that even when I'm hooked/strapped in and blasting there is still some weight going through my extended arms (holding) rather than transferring through the harness. My stance feels dialed in so I don't think it's that. When I switched to a seat harness I sailed with adjustables until I dialed in what I thought was the ideal length, then I bought fixed lines of that length. 32". I'm beginning to think perhaps 32" is simply too long and maybe 30" would take the edge off. I prefer fixed lines over adjustables.
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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 3854
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harness lines are cheap, experiment.
I'm 5'10" and 165 lbs., sailed in waves for years, ans still use 24" lines with seat harness...or waist.
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2583

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
I find that even when I'm hooked/strapped in and blasting there is still some weight going through my extended arms (holding) rather than transferring through the harness. My stance feels dialed in so I don't think it's that.


If you still feel weight going through your arms it is likely a harness line placement or commitment issue, not harness line length. The next time you are blasting try taking your front arm off the boom. Can you sail for an extended time in this position? Now do the same thing with your back arm. Can you sail for an extended time in this position? If you can't then your lines are not properly located. If yes to both, then as you sail constantly take one hand or the other off the boom as you sail. This will build the confidence in your harness.

Coachg
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 322
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coachg wrote:
mamero wrote:
I find that even when I'm hooked/strapped in and blasting there is still some weight going through my extended arms (holding) rather than transferring through the harness. My stance feels dialed in so I don't think it's that.


If you still feel weight going through your arms it is likely a harness line placement or commitment issue, not harness line length. The next time you are blasting try taking your front arm off the boom. Can you sail for an extended time in this position? Now do the same thing with your back arm. Can you sail for an extended time in this position? If you can't then your lines are not properly located. If yes to both, then as you sail constantly take one hand or the other off the boom as you sail. This will build the confidence in your harness.

Coachg


While blasting I am momentarily (for a few seconds) able to sail one-handed by removing the front or rear hand; sometimes quickly reaching back and touching the water with my backhand (good fun). Extended one-handed sailing with either hand is usually not really possible due to conditions. I do tend to frequently lift one hand at a time to briefly to ensure harness lines are still in the right place. However, in my area if there enough wind to be strapped/hooked and blasting, it also means sea-state is getting rough and "be ready for a gust".
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 322
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have noticed that sometimes it "feels" that my sail "might" be leaning too far to windward and that I am sailing very low; perhaps too low even for a seat harness. Sailing in a seat harness is a lower more outboard stance though so hard to say. However, it maybe would be good to bring my sail slightly more vertical thus bringing myself slightly higher as well. I wonder that if my lines where slightly shorter I could generally "let go" of my grip a little more, allowing the sail pull more through the lines and less through my arms/hands and bringing the sail a bit more verticle. If lines are too long it forces you to pull down on the boom more through the arms and hands (down-force, mast foot pressure) rather than through the harness lines. Just thinking about cause effect... Anyway, As far as my commitment as it relates to down force, I'd say 60-70% is through the hook, and 30-40% through the arms. This of course constantly changes as you sail along and with conditions. Sometimes a rouge gust or wave forces you to push down through the arms to avoid being yanked over the front.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 18534

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
Are tired forearms and tired hands a sign that perhaps your lines are TOO long? I find that even when I'm hooked/strapped in and blasting there is still some weight going through my extended arms (holding) rather than transferring through the harness..

YES!, for any given hook height, boom height, mast rake, stance, and sailing style.
I'll say it again: Our arms and hands are for jibing and advanced DTL wavesailing, not "sailing". That goes for everything from glassy water to big chop and swell, and can apply, once the skill is developed, for some quite advanced maneuvering if using a roller bar. I have big arms and shoulders, but I see no point in using (i.e., tiring) them unnecessarily.

Even the guru of extended-arm sailing, Nevin Sayre, said, "Oops; I was wrong".


Last edited by isobars on Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 3854
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you freestyle or foil, it's important to sheet out in gusts and sheet in and shift forwards in lulls.
The first is not applicable to freeride, bump n jump, slalom, or speed sailing. Instead, you lean back harder to counter gusts, transferring more power thru your harness.
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 483

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before changing lines lower boom slightly, then remember to keep rig upright rather than pull it over yourself. If the chop is smacking your butt then you are too low.

Do you generally hook in before getting in the straps?


Last edited by grantmac017 on Mon Jul 16, 2018 8:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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