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Let's Talk Cammed Sails
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2160
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rig the sail up. Does it rotate easily by itself (maybe with a minor yank to pop it through).

If so, you're good to go.

-Craig

p.s. if the guy was a serious racer, it'll be set up fine.

mamero wrote:
Do cammed sails need to be re-shimmed over time if using the same mast?
I bought that NX and mast together from the same person. This guy is a pretty serious racer and I'd assume he has already shimmed the cams (If needed). In sail bag there are a bunch of unused shims so it makes me wonder if it has been done. When do you know if you need to shim or, put too many shims in the cam?
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 569

PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
I probably will switch over to the two sided AO. It can't take that much longer to rig once the initial setup is done. Perhaps I should order a couple clew pulleys for the 8.6 and 7.5 to speed up and simplify the rigging. However, I am leery of too much swing weight at the clew; especially on a big sail. I'm OCD about keeping the boom as short as possible for this reason. I've seen some people sail with like 6 inches of extension hanging of the clew of their sail. Shorten your boom or buy a smaller one.

Question. What do you do with the excess line? Usually you would tie it off at the clew. With an AO the excess line is on one side of the boom near the pulley.


There are ways to setup a single to rig with the excess back through the cleat. The double will need to be tied on each time (although I think I might have a way around this).
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 3154

PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have doubles on five of my booms. They are dedicated to individual sails, so no changes needed. However, I have used one of the booms for a couple of sails and did need to make adjustments.

I have Maui Sails race sails, which all have a plastic pully type system instead of a grommet at the clew. Slip the lines on and off in four seconds. No tying or untying. The length of the line from the boom cleat attachment unit to the mid boom pully and back to the cleat, if it's long enough will give you some adjustability for different sails without having to do anything but adjust the boom length.

If you have to thread the line through a grommet at the clew, then adjustments can be made when you tie it back on to one of the mid boom pulleys to compensate for different boom lengths. No big deal

If there are no "mid boom" pulleys and the line goes straight to the clew from the cleat, then you just need to have a line just long enough for your largest sail, but will be longer and longer as you use the boom for smaller sails. No adjustments needed, just more dangling line at the cleat.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3261

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

78 wide race to free race boards, for me match up well with 40 cm molded fins of moderately good quality or better in central florida winds when using 9.0 to fairly lit up 7.2 sails.

when the 7.2 is maxed, it time to switch to a smaller board. so the fin, 40 cm custom select, has worked well for me for quite a long time. the need for anything other on such a combo is pretty negligible.

_________________
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www.iwindsurf.com
http://www.epicgearusa.com/
http://www.seanski.com/
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 353
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just did a trial rigging of my NX 8.6. PITA!!

Questions.
1. How do you keep the cams from popping off during rigging?? After more than an hour I gave up. Is there something wrong with my cams? I rigged as per the Sailworks instructions. FULL max outhaul. 1/2 - 2/3rds downhual. Unzip, pop on, rezip, final downhaul. The cams (top 2 in particular) will NOT stay on during that in-between stage. They seem to be at an angle to the mast and also slightly twisted. The don't sit flush with the mast and just pop off. Any comments or suggestions here would be greatly appreciated.

2. I have a carbon extension. Is it going to be OK with this rig? There is a lot of tension. I don't feel like snapping the extension when I on the water.

Other observations.
1. While test rigging I also swapped my single-sided adjustable outhaul to a Sailworks double. The line included with Sailworks' double sided outhaul is useless. It probably will be necessary to swap it out to some kind of solid core like Forumline. Furthermore, you are supposed to tie a bow line knot on one side every time you rig?! The process of going full outhaul to pop the cams on puts a LOT of tension on that knot. With that crappy line they give you it's virtually impossible to undue that knot when de-rigging. The last thing I want to do when I'm tired after a session is mess around undoing a bow line knot for half an hour. Anyone have a solution for this?
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2160
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the wonderful world of cams. ;*)

I've always been a little worried about a carbon extension, and have stuck
with aluminum with no problems. I would be really hesitant to run a carbon
extension anywhere near maximum extension on a race sail.

Call Sailworks and describe your issue, they may be able to shed some
light on it.

The sail should be almost flat with outhaul when you pop the cams on.

I remember my XT2 would do this until I actually massaged the upper cams down the mast a little, but I haven't rigged that sail in 14 years (maybe I should make a tarp out of it).

-Craig


mamero wrote:
Just did a trial rigging of my NX 8.6. PITA!!

Questions.
1. How do you keep the cams from popping off during rigging?? After more than an hour I gave up. Is there something wrong with my cams? I rigged as per the Sailworks instructions. FULL max outhaul. 1/2 - 2/3rds downhual. Unzip, pop on, rezip, final downhaul. The cams (top 2 in particular) will NOT stay on during that in-between stage. They seem to be at an angle to the mast and also slightly twisted. The don't sit flush with the mast and just pop off. Any comments or suggestions here would be greatly appreciated.

2. I have a carbon extension. Is it going to be OK with this rig? There is a lot of tension. I don't feel like snapping the extension when I on the water.

Other observations.
1. While test rigging I also swapped my single-sided adjustable outhaul to a Sailworks double. The line included with Sailworks' double sided outhaul is useless. It probably will be necessary to swap it out to some kind of solid core like Forumline. Furthermore, you are supposed to tie a bow line knot on one side every time you rig?! The process of going full outhaul to pop the cams on puts a LOT of tension on that knot. With that crappy line they give you it's virtually impossible to undue that knot when de-rigging. The last thing I want to do when I'm tired after a session is mess around undoing a bow line knot for half an hour. Anyone have a solution for this?
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3261

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 5:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you thread the mast thru the cams, do not let the battens touch the ground with little to no down haul tension. not easy, nor 100% successful technique.

best technique that gets faster with experience.

insert mast in sail without threading cams, mast over cams.
down haul enough to get boom attached to mast.
flatten out haul all the way.
reduce down haul
push cams onto mast, middle, top, then bottom
down haul to spec, or conditions
adjust out haul for sailing

carbon extensions have a couple of weaknesses:

a bit fragile if you drop onto a pointy object with forcefulness, or any other point loaded incident

breaking in surf when board rolls over mast

_________________
www.aerotechsails.com
www.exocet-original.com
www.iwindsurf.com
http://www.epicgearusa.com/
http://www.seanski.com/
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 569

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have the cam pockets unzipped and cams below the mast right? And you are zipping them back up before DH fully?

Try to DH until you have the pulleys maybe 8-10cm apart and OH at the recommended max length. They should gain tension against the mast as you DH. If they are hard to pop on then reduce initial DH a little, if they pop on easily then come off increase it.

Welcome to double sided OH, results typical. I use Chinook pulleys.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 9149

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing that I would suggest is after popping the cams onto the mast is to loosen the outhaul a bit before applying your full downhaul. This also makes it very easy to readjust to your proper boom height once downhaul is achieved. Adjusting your final outhaul is the last step in the process.

Regarding the adjustable outhaul, I would avoid using it until you're comfortable rigging the sail. Unless you're racing, an AO is really not that important. In my 32 years of sailing, I've never used an AO.
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joethewindsufa



Joined: 10 Oct 2010
Posts: 1019
Location: Montréal

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/2013/06/rigging-cambered-race-sail.html

today i rigged an older Gaastra Swift 10 m² sail
with 2 cambers and a narrow sleeve
supposed to rig it with the cambers on
same with the de-rigging
it was a PITA, but pure pleasure on the water
lightest 10 meter I have used
AND the cambers flipped like they were not even there
have not tried the HotSailsMaui SpeedFreak 10m² with one camber YET

if you guys with the foils don't need your larger sails any more
send 'em my way Very Happy
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