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isobars
Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935
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 Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Bond1 wrote: | | Interesting. For some perspective, an average of 30 mph has me at the upper range of my 3.7, or having already moved to my 3.2. I'm not sure what it means, but it's interesting. |
It means several things, including:
• Sensor readings' correlation with wind on the water varies with venues and wind direction.
• I weigh about 200#, and consistently use bigger sails than many guys bigger than I.
• I freaking HATE slogging, so if I’m not planing, I’m swimming or rigging up, both of which waste shred time I’ll never get back.
• I sail small boards relative to my weight.
• All my boards are wave boards, which eat power.
• You use your sail to get to the swell then surf it luffed, using gravity to supplant your sail power. My constant hard slashing scrubs off power and I use sail power to replace it; gravity is merely afterburner for me when I dive down a face with the hammer down. Different strokes, different needs.
• You want to stay on a face and use it as your playground; I want to blast down it and up it and down it and up it and down it and up it, often using it for a speed boost to catch downwind air up the back of the next wave downwind to drop in on the next trough.
• I love a big double handful of power, partly because I raced open class desert racing motorcycles for decades.
• I gotta/wanna rip way upwind very often to regain ground after frequent deep off-the-wind blasts from 50 to 500 feet in length; upwind on a sinker wave board in onshore conditions demands horsepower, as do very broad full-power reaches.
• Lastly, did I say I freaking HATE slogging?
Damn ... I've stoked my own self up. When does this stupid light easterly pattern let up ... next Thursday?
Mike \m/ |
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Bond1
Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 168
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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| isobars wrote: | | Bond1 wrote: | | Interesting. For some perspective, an average of 30 mph has me at the upper range of my 3.7, or having already moved to my 3.2. I'm not sure what it means, but it's interesting. |
It means several things, including:
• Sensor readings' correlation with wind on the water varies with venues and wind direction.
• I weigh about 200#, and consistently use bigger sails than many guys bigger than I.
• I freaking HATE slogging, so if I’m not planing, I’m swimming or rigging up, both of which waste shred time I’ll never get back.
• I sail small boards relative to my weight.
• All my boards are wave boards, which eat power.
• You use your sail to get to the swell then surf it luffed, using gravity to supplant your sail power. My constant hard slashing scrubs off power and I use sail power to replace it; gravity is merely afterburner for me when I dive down a face with the hammer down. Different strokes, different needs.
• You want to stay on a face and use it as your playground; I want to blast down it and up it and down it and up it and down it and up it, often using it for a speed boost to catch downwind air up the back of the next wave downwind to drop in on the next trough.
• I love a big double handful of power, partly because I raced open class desert racing motorcycles for decades.
• I gotta/wanna rip way upwind very often to regain ground after frequent deep off-the-wind blasts from 50 to 500 feet in length; upwind on a sinker wave board in onshore conditions demands horsepower, as do very broad full-power reaches.
• Lastly, did I say I freaking HATE slogging?
Damn ... I've stoked my own self up. When does this stupid light easterly pattern let up ... next Thursday?
Mike \m/ |
Some of those things probably, but not all of them.
* Sensor readings, sure, that makes sense.
* I weigh 170# and constantly use a sail smaller than guys my size.
* My board is around 70 liters, but it's fairly efficient.
* I'll slash with the sail powered, and depower by oversheeting when necessary. I'll use some gravity too. I'll take what it gives me. But, I like to use a lot of energy so I tend to stay powered through most of my moves.
* I don't like the big double handful of power. I can't turn the way I like with that much power. I learned to sail small and that became the new normal for me. I just went out and sailed around up to my knees half the time because when I got going it was worth it. (I had more energy then) So, like I said, it became my new normal, which is just different than your normal.
* I hate slogging too.
I think the point is we each do what works for us and it doesn't have to make sense to others. It's about having fun.
Speaking of changes, it used to be that every time a heat wave broke we had a big day. Often a dawn patrol. That's how I remember it anyway. That's another thing that seems to have changed. |
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isobars
Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Bond1 wrote: | 1. I just went out and sailed around up to my knees half the time ... I hate slogging
2. I think the point is we each do what works for us and it doesn't have to make sense to others. It's about having fun. |
#1 puzzles me.
#2 is all that counts.
Mike \m/ |
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Bond1
Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 168
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| isobars wrote: | | Bond1 wrote: | 1. I just went out and sailed around up to my knees half the time ... I hate slogging
2. I think the point is we each do what works for us and it doesn't have to make sense to others. It's about having fun. |
#1 puzzles me.
#2 is all that counts.
Mike \m/ |
#1 That was then. (early 80's) This is now. (nearly thirty years later/older. 
Then it was just fun to be out there. I had unlimited energy. And, I was going to get good at this small board thing, dammit! Now I really dislike slogging. |
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gmclean
Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 91
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Speaking of changes, it used to be that every time a heat wave broke we had a big day. Often a dawn patrol. That's how I remember it anyway. That's another thing that seems to have changed. |
I think a lot depends on how it breaks. Sometimes it breaks down slowly over a few days which usually means the first day is a bit weak. Gradients may be strong but if it is still warm then the air is less dense and we don't have a good capping inversion to trap the air at low levels. I think this happens more often when the heat breaks due to increased NW flow.
I think the best scenario for central gorge wind will be if the offshore low moves just close enough to get a nice push from the south and the Willamette Valley fills in with dense marine air. This is a classic setup for strong central gorge wind. The models do really poorly with the closed low offshore but at this point it looks like mid-week we could see this set-up develop. The interesting thing about this pattern to me is that the models often miss it. I have been burned many times when attempting to forecast this pattern and I have always under forecast it.
Hope it comes together 
George |
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Bond1
Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 168
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| Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:56 pm Post subject: |
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| gmclean wrote: | | Quote: | | Speaking of changes, it used to be that every time a heat wave broke we had a big day. Often a dawn patrol. That's how I remember it anyway. That's another thing that seems to have changed. |
I think a lot depends on how it breaks. Sometimes it breaks down slowly over a few days which usually means the first day is a bit weak. Gradients may be strong but if it is still warm then the air is less dense and we don't have a good capping inversion to trap the air at low levels. I think this happens more often when the heat breaks due to increased NW flow.
I think the best scenario for central gorge wind will be if the offshore low moves just close enough to get a nice push from the south and the Willamette Valley fills in with dense marine air. This is a classic setup for strong central gorge wind. The models do really poorly with the closed low offshore but at this point it looks like mid-week we could see this set-up develop. The interesting thing about this pattern to me is that the models often miss it. I have been burned many times when attempting to forecast this pattern and I have always under forecast it.
Hope it comes together
George |
I guess, anecdotally, it seems the trend has been toward the scenario where we don't get much wind the last several seasons, as compared to maybe the early 90's. Anecdotally, of course.
But, that doesn't keep me from hoping..... |
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isobars
Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935
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| Posted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 8:29 am Post subject: |
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| Bond1 wrote: | | Then it was just fun to be out there. I had unlimited energy. And, I was going to get good at this small board thing, dammit! Now I really dislike slogging. |
Another, easier IMO, way to get good at "this small board thing" is to power an exceptional small board up to the hilt and push one's own limits rather than be limited by planing power. I am certain, and a highly qualified observer volunteered, that I doubled my sailing ability in one evening in 1992 that way. Lots quicker, lots more fun, instant gratification.
"I hear your pain" about slogging, yet we both see countless people slogging at any given instant, some fully half their time on most Gorge days. I know a few who clearly (because they literally slog throughout every session) don't like planing, a few who have told me they enjoy slogging on sinkers, and a few more who are willing to slog much of the time to make tricks easier on smaller sails, but I've got to guess that the other 10,000 capable sailors I see slogging a LOT in Gorge winds are simply unaware that they could readily manage and thoroughly enjoy a bigger sail if they just trusted their gear more and TRIED IT. Do Dusty or Dale or Bruce EVER slog because they don't trust their ability to manage more sail?
I'm not criticizing anyone, or boasting, or complaining when I suggest bigger sails to sloggers. I'm just trying to encourage them to learn to trust and use bigger sails to increase their ratio of pleasure to pain. Almost every gusty day I see far better sailors than I slogging half the time, and I just don't get it. Every slog is a screaming reach, an off-the-lip, or a loop missed and never to be regained.
Mike \m/ |
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Bond1
Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 168
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| Posted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| isobars wrote: | | Bond1 wrote: | | Then it was just fun to be out there. I had unlimited energy. And, I was going to get good at this small board thing, dammit! Now I really dislike slogging. |
Another, easier IMO, way to get good at "this small board thing" is to power an exceptional small board up to the hilt and push one's own limits rather than be limited by planing power. I am certain, and a highly qualified observer volunteered, that I doubled my sailing ability in one evening in 1992 that way. Lots quicker, lots more fun, instant gratification.
"I hear your pain" about slogging, yet we both see countless people slogging at any given instant, some fully half their time on most Gorge days. I know a few who clearly (because they literally slog throughout every session) don't like planing, a few who have told me they enjoy slogging on sinkers, and a few more who are willing to slog much of the time to make tricks easier on smaller sails, but I've got to guess that the other 10,000 capable sailors I see slogging a LOT in Gorge winds are simply unaware that they could readily manage and thoroughly enjoy a bigger sail if they just trusted their gear more and TRIED IT. Do Dusty or Dale or Bruce EVER slog because they don't trust their ability to manage more sail?
I'm not criticizing anyone, or boasting, or complaining when I suggest bigger sails to sloggers. I'm just trying to encourage them to learn to trust and use bigger sails to increase their ratio of pleasure to pain. Almost every gusty day I see far better sailors than I slogging half the time, and I just don't get it.
Mike \m/ |
The process evolved for me, and there was plenty of super powered sailing back then. No doubt when you're planing you're going to learn more about how to sail your gear than when you're not planing.
As I recall, back then, after having the thrill of planing on a 9'6" glass board I wanted more. I'm sure we can all remember that thrill. So if there was a chance I could get a ride or two I'd suffer through some slogging. When a gust came I'd plane and nearly pee my pants with excitement while zooming past my friends. As time went on I'd plane more and slog less, which fueled this desire to get out on the small board even more. Unlimited energy didn't hurt. I learned to not be afraid. I learned I would always make it back. I learned to be efficient.
So I suppose it wasn't really that I needed to learn small, but rather that I was so addicted to the small board ride that I just went out, and becoming efficient was a side effect. When some folks look at the conditions thinking it looks a bit holy and that they ought to rig bigger to get through the holes, I look at the conditions and see conditions that are good enough to get me out on my smaller gear. It wasn't a plan. It just happened.
Meanwhile my best friend back then would rig a sail one or two sizes larger than mine, and use a bigger board. He was a bigger guy who needed (and loved) power. We each learned back then that there were different approaches to the same conditions. We were both having a good time.
Regarding slogging, two mistakes I see people make are 1) Sailing relative to the geography rather than the wind. Going 90 degrees to the shoreline doesn't work when the wind is skewed a bit. 2) A reluctance to give up a little ground to get planing. Get planing at any cost and have the confidence that you can use the speed and apparent wind to gain what you've lost and then some.
Once again, it's all about the fun factor. Hopefully by mid week we'll be too busy sailing, and too tired after, to bore everyone with our history. |
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WMP
Joined: 30 May 2000
Posts: 671
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| Posted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:39 am Post subject: |
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| Bond1 wrote: | We each learned back then that there were different approaches to the same conditions. We were both having a good time.
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Different approaches just don't jibe with mindless, robotic groupthink.
Back then there were so many choices. Now it's more and more a mechanized one size fits all world. You go either wave or freestyle... them are the only choices now.
They've taken away the choice of manual transmissions, windsurfing gear now only offers automatic transmissions.
Dang, whatever happened to adjustable fin boxes... can't find 'em on any new production boards today. |
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Bond1
Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 168
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| Posted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 11:27 am Post subject: |
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| WMP wrote: |
Dang, whatever happened to adjustable fin boxes... can't find 'em on any new production boards today. |
Custom boards are still available for those who are inclined. (thank goodness) Adjust your fin or add more fins. You're choice. |
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