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Windsurfing Magazine -- RIP
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kellygeygan



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually that is the plan...moving to a warm water,more windy location has been my dream for years...BUT gotta pay off my house and arrange my business strategy 2.6 years....or as soon as the dollar collapses...whatever is first.
I like sailing 11.0 ,having opportunity to windsurf is a gift no matter the gear selection.
Suggestion: move. Thousands of us have, just for that reason, with zero regrets. Tens of millions of people live near wind and water; come join us and burn them eleven-meter drive-in movie screens forever!
isobars wrote:
jsampiero wrote:
WINDSURFING magazine did nothing of the sort.

There was as much, if not more, moderate and light-wind coverage it's early and I must be cranky!

Easily understood. Besides, the only issues I've saved from 1998 to 2011 have been the high-wind board test issues. Why? Because I agree with
what boracayboardhead wrote:
“Was a subscriber for years. No so much for the euipment tests as I can only afford used stuff"
but for a different reason: I PREFER the older stuff, and where else can I start picking and choosing it (and choosing which new stuff merits reality checks) than in those saved high-wind board tests?

kellygeygan wrote:
Must be windy where you live....doubt you would be sailing much where 90% of the population exists.

Suggestion: move. Thousands of us have, just for that reason, with zero regrets. Tens of millions of people live near wind and water; come join us and burn them eleven-meter drive-in movie screens forever! Wink

Mike \m/
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johnl



Joined: 05 Jun 1994
Posts: 1329
Location: Hood River OR

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A simple e-mail to Bonnier Corp got me a quick reply on changing my subscription. These were the choices...

Additional Titles:
American Photo
Babytalk
Boating
Caribbean Travel + Life
Cruising World
Cycle World
Destination Weddings & Honeymoons
Field & Stream
Florida Travel + Life
Fly Fishing in Salt Waters
Flying
Garden Design
Islands
Marlin
Motor Boating
Outdoor Life
Parenting
Popular Photography
Popular Science
Sailing World
Salt Water Sportsman
Saveur
Science Illustrated
Scuba Diving
SKI
Skiing
SNOW
Sound + Vision
Sport Diver
Sport Fishing
TransWorld Business
TransWorld Motocross
TransWorld Ride BMX
TransWorld SKATEboarding
TransWorld SNOWboarding
TransWorld SURF
TransWorld WAKEBOARDING
WaterSki
Working Mother
Yachting

Another quick phone call and I got my subscription changed from Transworld Suf (which I really could care less about) to something that would interest me. The sad part is that I have over 30 issues paid. I guess I wanted too many of the Windsurfing Mag freebees and resubscribed too soon.... Rolling Eyes
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tomg



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 275

PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

" Working Mother"? Sounds like getto-speak for what we use to call a "working stiff!

I agree, though the sport and hence the market has dipped way down, there is still a need and a void left by WS Mag. I encourage Josh and others to look at an internet zine with a subscription model.

And next time around (and I hope there is), try to balance out all the 1500 dollar board tests with stories about 75 buck swap meet finds and whether anybody REALLY pays "retail".

- Tom G.
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ShreddinEd



Joined: 27 Mar 1994
Posts: 170

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to add my voice to the chorus of people both praising Windsurfing Magazine for it's work over the years, and Josh and company in particular for working so hard over so thankless a job. I agree with others, I'm sure it had nothing to do with the content of the mag, but rather, the economic conditions of the times and the fact that windsurfing is a niche sport with a small market. I still love the sport anyhow and will do it until they pry the booms from my cold dead fingers.

Also, I had the chance to meet Josh at the Waddell contest this summer and he seemed like a cool and enthusiastic guy. The sport needs more like him. If you can find another gig in the sport, online publishing or otherwise, we'll be there for you.

Thanks!
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3341

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i was harping about the big $$$$ in advertising for years to bonnier types upon deaf ears. dunno the why's in the lack of performance, just the results.

$$$$

cars
beer
pizza
lawyering
insurance

cars, oh i said that already. a competitor of iwindy has a local tire company ad!!!!!!! they are from out of the country! hello!

mags need ad dollars. reality, doesn't matter from whom. look at all the minivans in a windsurf parking lot. where were the ads?

if one decides to go for this market's vaccum, keep in mind where the money is in advertising. don't turn your back to it. esp since there's nothing like that first beer after a good long sesh!

_________________
www.aerotechsails.com
www.exocet-original.com
www.iwindsurf.com
http://www.epicgearusa.com/
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kellygeygan



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:35 am    Post subject: Re: Windsurfing Magazine -- RIP Reply with quote

goinoff wrote:
Bummer Days!!

Got my first issue of Transworld surf yesterday in replacement for remaining issues of Windsurfing Mag. Big surprise for me...Yet not...Nothing lasts forever..


many things last forever....things like truth.

. The calcup series is going strong with races every month starting in April till August. The StFYC host the friday night series from March- Sept with racing every other week. There are 5 major regattas this summer in SF for formula and slalom boards which include long distance, sprint and slalom style racing.
Finally- we are organizing the formula north american champs this summer in SF with 50+ formula racers from around the world expected to come + the formula world championship next summer with 150 expected.
For the first time in almost 5 years a new windsurfing shop has opened in the SF Bay-in addition to boardsports school which actively teaches and sells gear form coyote point.




On a personal level...

I enjoyed reading many of your articles and believe you are far from finished in the industry.You are talented and have brought a lot of joy to your readers, including me........Your following of loyal fans says a lot about you..It appears SUP is doing quite well and the magazine was clearly a huge positive influence in that market.



On a business level....

"we tried that"
So what you are saying is that you did have a Formula Board shootout? ...I must have missed that edition after waiting since the 2000 board tests.Please dont tell me you are referring to that light wind slalom stuff that didnt work in my area.That stuff was tried,failed and sold in a few months.

"too technical"
really? In my area 90% of the people use formula 90% of the time...That group includes elderly men and yes,even women..They are not very technical people
Driving hundreds of miles or flying thousands of miles to use the gear promoted by WMag seems a little bit too technical in comparison.


The magazine made a choice ,a calculated risk.The choice may have been motivated by Advertisers fear that one Formula Board and two sails could effectively cover a wind range of 10 to 20 kts,
thereby making obsolete the many "needed" pieces of equipment the magazine chose to promote.
Also threatened were travel and vacation interests because with Formula working so well at home there was little need to travel anymore....Follow the money,but the money supply left as the subscribers left.Many are now kiters.Many quit windsurfing.

I sailed 53 "out of touch" GPS miles yesterday and thought of you when I waved to my KITER friends who used to windsurf. We still call each other to issue wind alerts,we share launches and even help each other.



Dividing into seperate factions destroys natural continuity among waterpeople and that was likely a part of the windsurfing implosion...it was clearly done from within our own group and continues even now.
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kellygeygan



Joined: 10 Apr 2000
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From Josh Sampiero

While Formula boards may offer the best light-air performance, the 1) Technical skill used to ride them 2)necessity for big sails 3) higher cost compared to free-ride gear meant they were a small and shrinking portion of boards sold each year. Formula boards, although light-wind performers with the ability to offer thrills in any area of the USA, not exactly "approachable""
.........................................................................................
Amazing, the power of denial.

Bad info from a "knowledgeable" source is still bad info...


OK... lets sift thru the trash


1) "Technical skill used to ride them"

You must be referring to RACING Formula because riding them is super easy.
From 80L wave boards to 240 liter longboards I have NEVER used anything easier.


2)"necessity for big sails "

Once again it sounds like a reference to RACING Formula.
The fact is this, transmitting power to the water with a longer{Formula} fin is more efficcient than with a shorter fin...this means a SMALLER sail can be used.
Larger sails are a must for Racing ...not freeriding.

3)" higher cost compared to free-ride gear meant they were a small and shrinking portion of boards sold each year. Formula boards, although light-wind performers with the ability to offer thrills in any area of the USA, not exactly "approachable""


Higher cost? Formula boards cost no more than a
freeride board and since they work with any sail , you likely already have a sail for it......Sounds approachable to me

"small and shrinking portion of boards sold"

Could this be attributed to the lack of accurate and impartial reporting on the topic? Look at the rise in SUP sales after a positive write up.The same attention given to Formula would have yeilded at least that much growth.

Why?

Because it is the ONLY high performance ,affordable,multi use unit that is accessable to all and NOTHING yet invented can rival Formula.



Might be wise to learn the subject before writing about it.

You didnt really sink the ship.You just let it hit the iceberg.

Oh yea....strike three....Good riddance Windsuffering Magazine







jsampiero wrote:
"Cognitive dissonance"?

Now it doesn't sound like talking trash, it sounds like an insult.

Here's where I see cognitive dissonance:

You said, in summary:

WINDSURFING magazine failed as a business because it ignored the light-air, real-world conditions and applications, choosing to focus on the sex appeal of high-wind excitement."

I responded:

Indeed, that is a mistake WINDSURFING, the magazine, and windsurfing the industry had made in the past, but those who have been reading the magazine with any regularity during my tenure, as well as the tenure of Eddy P before me, will have noticed a concerted effort to be grass-roots and real-world connected.


You replied, in summary: The same argument as the first time, with an Ayn Rand quote thrown in for good measure.


It appears the main basis of your argument is that we didn't test something important to you: Formula boards.

While Formula boards may offer the best light-air performance, the 1) Technical skill used to ride them 2)necessity for big sails 3) higher cost compared to free-ride gear meant they were a small and shrinking portion of boards sold each year. Formula boards, although light-wind performers with the ability to offer thrills in any area of the USA, not exactly "approachable."

If I have a limited amount of pages per issue and per year, I'm going to spend them on the product that has the widest appeal: free-ride and free-race boards between 100-150 liters.

For approachable, I considered SUP sailing far more approachable than Formula. I think a lot of people would agree with me. As mentioned in my first reply, this got a lot of play in WINDSURFING.

Your theory as to "how we could have been successful":

kellygeygan wrote:
Concentrate on affordable equipment,that works efficiently in prevailing conditions Nationwide and secure a large following of loyal subscribers.This approach is affordable initially and long term because there is no need to travel...this is not glamorous or extreme..but it is reality to 90% of us 90% of the time.


Let me put it to you bluntly: We tried that.

However, the logic relies on a false premise: that there is a large following of potentially loyal subscribers to be gained. I know what our subscription numbers were, and while they had diminished, it was less so than one might think. WINDSURFING maintained one of the highest renewal rates in the company. (CBknap, I don't have those exact numbers that you asked for. I can tell you our circulation has decreased over that time.)

That said, it needs to be acknowledged: There's not a ton of windsurfers out there, and the people that DO windsurf aren't spending money on new gear every year.

Sailing 42 miles may put you in touch with yourself, but by no means puts you in touch with everything that is going on in the windsurfing industry. Here's three big reasons why WINDSURFING is out of business:

The costs of being in the print industry have increased, while revenues have decreased. This is across the board and not particular to WINDSURFING. There was also less than stellar performance in converting print revenue to online revenue - and brands began spending more of their marketing budgets on being "their own agency". (See: Red Bull).

Less windsurfing gear has been sold in the last two years than any year in my lifetime.

The parent company elected not to give the brand adequate support to expand their business model to produce forms of revenue beyond customer subscriptions and advertising. In all honesty, this may have been the smartest business decision.

[/b]
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19932

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kellygeygan wrote:
Because it is the ONLY high performance ,affordable,multi use unit that is accessable to all and NOTHING yet invented can rival Formula.


That depends on how one defines "performance". Formula gear will not readily do one thing many of us are into WSing for. It's niche gear (just as our gear is), and thousands of us, even in the heartland, have zero interest in its niche. WSing is all about preferences, and Formula gear does not intersect with mine except at the racing-level, heart-in-yer-throat edge of its Venn diagram ... yet I am, and apparently a few hundred thousand others are, not interested in racing.

At the places I sail every breezy to windy day for about 7-8 months each year, with 10 to 200 of my closest friends, I've seen one ... ONE ... formula board on the water in the past 20 years. We're there for the swell or for freestyle, so the folks who have Formula gear stashed in their vans don't advertise the fact. If it's not windy enough for OUR niche gear, we whine or dweeb or wait or go home or wait AND whine, or we switch to kites and still whine or dweeb when the wind's too strong or weak or gusty.

Yes, Formula gear would add hundreds, maybe thousands, of hours to our planing opportunity each year. But believe it or not, "just planing" isn't enough reward for many of us to get past the purchase, schlepping, space, and rigging of a whole 'nuther kind of stuff. If there's enough wind for a 6.2, we're going to be on something ... ANYTHING ... much smaller, and more maneuverable. Them giant sails (e.g., a 7.5) just don't float our boats.

But hinting that either preference is "trash" isn't very thoughtful. If everyone wanted the same conditions and had the same preferences, there would be only one kind of gear on the market and the best spot for it would have 10,000 people at it all season. Thank goodness for individual preferences.
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2361
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes denial is an amazing power. You spend a huge amount of money
on a formula rig and by golly, it's the best thing that happened to
windsurfing, even if you secretly hate the ride. I've ridden formula
boards, I dislike them enough to never own one, because of the
gyrations you have to go through to ride one. For light wind, I've
got a 9.5 and a 155Ltr Angulo Sumo. It's fun to ride, and you
don't have to be on a close reach to enjoy it (though it will go upwind),
and the thing will actually turn (albeit slowly). What that has to do with
magazines and how they succeed, or fail I can't quite fathom, but
I do know what I like, and what I don't like.

-Craig

kellygeygan wrote:
From Josh Sampiero

While Formula boards may offer the best light-air performance, the 1) Technical skill used to ride them 2)necessity for big sails 3) higher cost compared to free-ride gear meant they were a small and shrinking portion of boards sold each year. Formula boards, although light-wind performers with the ability to offer thrills in any area of the USA, not exactly "approachable""
.........................................................................................
Amazing, the power of denial.

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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 9831

PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I have nothing against formula windsurfing, the package isn't always that viable at the popular venues where I sail. Ever try launching a formula rig with a 70cm fin in the surf with a rocky bottom with lots of kelp around once you get off the beach? Of course, not all ocean launches offer such an impossible set of circumstances, but finding a more suitable launch site might mean that you're sailing all by yourself with no one else around.
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