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the big lie "the media is liberal"
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coyotewindsurf



Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 1257
Location: SF Bay

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

boggsman1, was that a hit and run? Wink
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mo
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 13273

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pointster wrote:
I'm not trying to play games, I'm responding your comment:
"You say I’ve been “directly contradicted with primary evidence” and referenced my “failure to own up to the errors”, yet in the dozens of times I’ve challenged you and others point blank to provide evidence to support such claims and have then watched for replies from anyone, all we see is fart jokes and repeated vague accusations...."

I have provided evidence to support the claim that you were in error on the issue of whether the border fence was only 5% completed. I was not vauge, and did not resort to fart jokes.

Your games, intended or not, include in part:
• Ignoring the evidence I posted for my claims regarding the fence and border security overall, which you admit are interrelated but not the same. To wit in very short part, yet again:
One of many sources is this one of May 10, 2011, from the author of the 2008 “Complete the Fence Act”: http://tinyurl.com/42ebj53 .
An excerpt:
“Five years ago, legislation was passed to build a 700-mile double-layer border fence along the southwest border. This is a promise that has not been kept.
Today, according to staff at the Department of Homeland Security, just 5 percent of the double-layer fencing is complete, only 36.3 miles [5.2% of 700 miles. That's not cut and paste as Coboardhead implied; it's arithmetic.] The Government Accountability Office (GAO), Congress’s investigative arm, reported in early 2009 that only 32 miles of double-layer fencing had been built. That means under President Obama, only 4.3 miles of double layer fencing has been built. This is woefully inadequate.

While the border-fence construction lags, Mexican cartels continue to smuggle drugs, weapons, and illegal aliens into our country, attracting violent crime [the DHS metric for border protection adequacy]. The United States Attorney’s Annual Statistical Report for Fiscal Year 2009 stated that “violence along the border of the United States and Mexico has increased dramatically in recent years.”

“Complete the Fence Act” author’s comments from 2008
http://tinyurl.com/3nb724k include
“In direct conflict with the requirements set by Congress in 2006, DHS Secretary Chertoff has recently attempted to count vehicle barriers that stand only a few feet high and can easily be walked around as part of total fencing completed. DHS claims to have completed 302 miles of fencing by counting 134 miles of vehicle barriers. DHS has actually only completed 167 miles of physical, pedestrian fencing.”

• Ignoring my concession to your misleading and disingenuous attempt to confine border security to fencing, to wit, from two years ago [why are you kicking this dead horse without introducing any new information?]. From May 15, 2011 [OK, OK, that's just one year, 11 months, three weeks, and one day ago, fergodssake]:
<<<<<
As I said, Obama's words "basically complete" are not technically a lie relevant to the "fence law". The lie is his obvious but deliberately false message that our border is basically 1) fenced and 2) secure/controlled/deterring illegal immigration. Both of those messages are deliberate false statements, aka lies.

When I discuss a lie, a liar, a Marxist, a bible-thumper, a fascist, socialized medicine, a redneck, a yankee, a liberal, a conservative, socialized medicine, a radical Islamic terrorist, etc., I'm going to use those words rather than type out a euphemistic paragraph. It saves time and cuts to the chase, and any person who doesn't like wearing that shoe when it fits should consider changing his shoes.

Obama has been caught reading indisputable lies from teleprompters many times, so this debatable instance, as spoken words, is just noise. Because it came from a campaigner reciting campaign rhetoric while masquerading as our president, the message becomes at least as important as the words, however. >>>>>>

• Yet another game: You imply that because you seldom engage in personal rhetoric (included in fart jokes) that my "all I see" is not true. That's a game, as you know damned well the actual percentage is upwards of 99%, that virtually EVERY challenge to this group of hyenas to prove that I've lied, or am racist, or attack individuals without proof, relevance, and purpose is met with childish banter rather than evidence. That's an "all" in this context. Of the entire cohort here, even with filters off, only you and bajadean, plus Cob once in a great while, make anything close to legitimate occasional attempts to debate the topic rather than discussing ancestry or scurrying away under the kitchen lights. The rest have produced not one such adult response I remember in many years.

On this topic I initially thought maybe you had me, that I had made a mistake of fact deserving of retraction. Once again, the archives relieved me of that concern.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3328
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coyotewindsurf wrote:
boggsman1, was that a hit and run? Wink

Yes, I'm trying to do everything and exercise a little self control. BUT, I will add that ISO has insisted for years that Bush tried to stop the mortgage madness, which is a falsehood of biblical proportions.
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coyotewindsurf



Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 1257
Location: SF Bay

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. I thought I was seeing things. Smile
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2203

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We're in good company
http://mentalfloss.com/article/48601/benjamin-franklin-and-jonathan-swift-were-fart-joke-masters

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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3017

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to note that the conversation on this forum has returned to mikey. He lives for this and loves the abuse because other wise we would just ignore him in contempt like the rest of the world.

It is usual among the troubled children at our school to attract abuse because they prefer that to a life of being forgotten.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1247

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mo, and K.C. Memories of teaching, and dealing with miscreants.

The normal pattern of indignant denial of any involvement and assertion that they are NOT lying, then, when confronted with evidence, that oh so predictable side step and attempt at deflection. .......they're all lying to get me into trouble etc etc etc etc!

Some people are so readable.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2344

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler wrote:
"... I do not lie."


Does anyone really believe that?

I'd be lying if I said "yes."

But it begs a question: Is gross misstatement, horrible and utter distortion of facts (while leaving a molecule of truth buried in there), and world-class misrepresentation considered lying?
.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3017

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is considered Talk Radio.
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pointster



Joined: 22 Jul 2010
Posts: 149

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike,

Again, I will point out that your first post on this subject was:

"The border fence is basically complete"? It's only 5% finished, you liar, and a pickup truck can drive across parts of it.

When a 2009 AP story confirming that the fence was mainly completed was quoted, you countered with some 2008 quotes (from former Sen. Jim DeMint, I believe) basically saying the fence did not conform to the 2006 legislation.

I then posted:

"The original border fence requirements were changed in a 2007 budget reconciliation bill. The changes were pushed by Texas Republican Senators.

Obama has proceded with constructing the border fence as required by the law in place when he took office. It would be gracious of you to retract your statement calling Obama a liar, but I don't expect it."

Your reply was :

"I cited sources. All you're providing is your claim. Back it up. That's how this works."

Which I did, citing and quoting the legislation, and a CBP report.

Up until then, your contention was that the fence was only 5% complete. Only after that did you change your line to:

"Saying "the fence is basically up" is a word game implying the border is fairly secure."

So when your original claim was shown not to be true, you merely changed to a new claim, and had the chutzpah to accuse others of playing word games.

And now here you are, torturing the language, equating "virtually EVERY" with "all", as in:

"That's an "all" in this context."

That is almost as good as Bill Clinton's famous quote:

"It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is."

Anyhow, I'm done with this.
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