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Pipe dream? Obamacare
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reinerehlers



Joined: 25 Jul 2001
Posts: 982

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:

If I was a child born into todays society, I'd far rather be raised by a mother of Faith, Hope, and Charity, than one who rejects marriage, and practises abortion when it suits her purposes. (Over here we are free to express such views without being screeched at by alley cats!

I know the context which this comment was made. Perhaps I should have highlighted your comment for you so you could see what I was taking from it.
Over here we are free to express such views without being screeched at by alley cats!
Perhaps you could provide of list of views or beliefs where you find the screeching is warranted. This is the hypocrisy I am referring to. You enjoy that you can "express such views" but are not willing to extend the same courtesy to others when they do not agree with yours and join the approach of the alley cats you scorn.
And once again you put words in my mouth that I dismiss science. I said that much of science is theory until it is proven a fact. There is a difference you know. I also realise that because society accepts theory when progammed ad nauseam doesn't make it fact either. It means that society believes or accepts in a Pavlovian response to their conditioning.
Once again, I am addressing the approach and not the message. There is a difference here to, and I think that you would agree with that based upon your comments made in the Global Cooling thread.


Last edited by reinerehlers on Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:27 am; edited 2 times in total
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2667

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Fick-shun wrote:
CBO now doubles its estimate of the cost of Obamacare and projects that 7 million fewer people in the United States will have employment-based insurance by 2023. Look it up.

You mean this graph from the CBO that shows the Feb. 2013 cost data LOWER than all previous estimates?

This data, Mikey?



You are such a clown, Mr. Fick-shun.
.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 1344

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While in nostalgic mood - a small group of us argumentative know all students voluntarily attended our college Vice Principals little Divinity get togethers. (he was a Canon in the C.of E.)

He was very robust in dismissing nonsense, which is why his views carried weight with us, and he used the Old Testament stories and fables as metaphors.

His favourite dismissal of anyone inclined to believe the Noahs Ark fable was along the lines of,'how many species of insect do you suppose inhabit the Amazon rain forests?'

I used that line on the intelligent daughter of a Jehovas Witness who'd been brought up to accept the O.T. as literal fact, along with the genetic impossibility of sole survivors Noah and his family, re populating the whole of the earth. (Incest necessary.)

When I got into inevitable bother with higher authority, my defence was the teaching of my old tutor, and his robust rejection of such nonsense. Fortunately, I escaped with a telling off, but seriously, what DOES a teacher do when faced with such illogical nonsense?
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5816

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"I also realise that because society accepts theory when progammed ad nauseam doesn't make it fact either. It means that society believes or accepts in a Pavlovian response to their conditioning."


reinerehlers, it's interesting that you brought the above comments up. It clearly supports the point that I was making in the other thread you're referring to. It's no big surprise that folks believe in what has been driven into their head all their lives. Folks can carry all sorts of baggage, and it can be argued that a good portion of it can be heaped on by others, and I'm not talking about what is coming from the other side of the fence.

Speaking as one that didn't get the programming surrounding The Creation and intelligent design theories, I'm not encumbered by it. So, when it come to science and related theories that come from it, I don't have to reconcile the differences.
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keycocker



Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 3358

PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RR,
No offense but since I agree with you about posting something sensible and attaching an insult perhaps you might examine your recent posts.
"Stupid"
" you have joined he ranks of the screeching alley cats"
",bunch of whiners" repeated three times.
My children are more mature ....
Idiots...
The main difference I see in your posts is that these guys are insuting one another in heated debates, but you are insulting everyone who posts here without regard to individual differences.
If you read through this thread you will find the most offensive poster of the moment is yourself.
To your credit I still agree with your point that such behavior is childish.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14163

PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's bad enough now, and will go downhill. Despite the four insurance plans I pay for -- all U.S. government plans -- their combined coverage caps cover only a third to a half of the physical therapy I'm going to need for my knee over the next 12-15 months. I'll have to pay full retail cash out of my pocket for anything not covered. The Medicare billing agents telling me that say I'm lucky to be getting started now, as both the caps and the basic approval likelihood will get much worse under the ACA. My only other option is to appeal for special exemption and accept a much lesser grade of physical therapy than my surgeon insists I need.

No wonder Delta Airlines has announced their official estimate that the ACA will cost them ... and thus their employees and customers ... a $100,000,000 spike in health care costs in 2014.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4115

PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1st of all Isobars, I wish you a quick and speedy recovery. 2nd, you should take physical therapy with a grain of salt. I'd go to the initial PT sessions, but to save money, just continue the work at home. There are incredible resources on line to supplement the PT. And, do not underestimate nutrition and attitude.

Finally, you may be able to fight the cancer with a less stressful lifestyle. I'd suggest voting D, getting some medical marijuana, putting your baseball hat on backwards, and enjoying the final breakdown of society on your flat screen TV.... Laughing

ps...lay off the pharmaceuticals man. They'll kill you.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14163

PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevenbard wrote:
you should take physical therapy with a grain of salt. I'd go to the initial PT sessions, but to save money, just continue the work at home. There are incredible resources on line to supplement the PT. And, do not underestimate nutrition and attitude.

Finally, you may be able to fight the cancer with a less stressful lifestyle. I'd suggest voting D, getting some medical marijuana, putting your baseball hat on backwards, and enjoying the final breakdown of society on your flat screen TV.... Laughing

ps...lay off the pharmaceuticals man. They'll kill you.

The surgeon expects serious pharmas to be necessary only for the first couple of days post-op, until the bone pain intensity moderates.

The two most powerful ways to maximize the length and quality of our lives are proper diet and proper exercise. Check, and check.

I will be asking the specialist PTs every session why I can't do in the gym on my own anything they're doing in their torture chamber. For example, is electrical quadriceps stimulation better than the appropriate Nautilus machine? Sports PT after knee reconstruction requires more than ordinary PT, even assuming the ordinary ones are good PTs. I've had one PT tell me the ACL's only function is to keep the tibia from sliding forward in straight line stops (BZZZZZT; WRONG!), another telling me I don't need no steenkin' ACL or menisci to windsurf, and a third having me do just what you suggest but at very low levels ... all contrary to multiple surgeons' and fellow knee patients' insistence. The conflicting advice has to be reconciled, and that will take some time. Every school and pro sports team physician in town uses pretty much the same PhD sports specialist PT team I've consulted, which does nothing but rehab amateur and pro athletes. One consultation with them has already made a vast improvement over my previous PT, who is very good but has had only 2 ACL patients.

Besides, I'm not going to sacrifice any health to cost considerations. My knee is more valuable to me than money.

My attitude has been excellent. Stuff happens, and you deal with it. Simple. Some research here, a killfile there, a little surgery and/or PT now and then, and most of life's evils go away until the next alligator demands attention. I don't even have to look at wind forecasts now until next summer or maybe even 2015, depending on which knee guy is right; that alone saves hundreds of hours, a LOT of angst, and several thousand bucks in gasoline. There's any out-of-pocket medical costs right there.

I don't expect U.S. society to break down dramatically in my lifetime. Erode, certainly, but not collapse. About the only proactive steps I'm actively taking towards that prospect are voting R as many times as I can get away with and loading my stretched Roth IRA vaults up with metals any day now.
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 3554
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok ISO, I will alert the folks at Fort Knox.
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stevenbard



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 4115

PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back on topic...How could this be? This story is painful.

Obama Care. Just wait to see what happen in 2013 & 2014!
Age 76 Today, I went to the Dr. for my monthly B12 shot that I have been getting for a number of years. The nurse came and got me, got out the needle filled and ready to go then looked at the computer and got very quiet and asked if I was prepared to pay for it. I said no that my insurance takes care of it.
She said, that Medicare had turned... it down and went to talk to my Dr. about it. 15 minutes later she came back and said, she was sorry but they had tried every-thing they could but Medicare is beginning to turn many things away for seniors because of the projected Obama Care coming in. She was brushing at tears and said, "Some day they too will get old", I am so very sorry!!
Please for the sake of many good people. . . ..be informed please .
YOU ARE NOT GOING TO LIKE THIS...
At age 76 when you most need it, you arenot eligible for cancer treatment
* see page 272
What Nancy Pelosi didn't want us to know until after the healthcare bill was passed. Remember she said, "We have to pass the Bill so that we can see what's in it." Well, here it is.
Obama Care Highlighted by Page Number
THE CARE BILL HB 3200
JUDGE KITHIL IS THE 2ND OFFICIAL WHO HAS OUTLINED THESE PARTS OF THE CARE BILL.
Judge Kithil of Marble Falls, TX - highlighted the most egregious pages of HB3200
Please read this....... especially the reference to pages 58 & 59

JUDGE KITHIL wrote:
**
Page 50/section 152: The bill will provide insurance to all non-U.S. residents, even if they are here illegally.

**
Page 58 and 59: The government will have real-time access to an individual's bank account and will have the authority to make electronic fund transfers from those accounts.

**
Page 65/section 164: The plan will be subsidized (by the government) for all union members, union retirees and for community organizations (such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now - ACORN).

**
Page 203/line 14-15: The tax imposed under this section will not be treated as a tax. (How could anybody in their right mind come up with that?)

**
Page 241 and 253: Doctors will all be paid the same regardless of specialty, and the government will set all doctors' fees.

**
Page 272. section 1145: Cancer hospital will ration care according to the patient's age.

**
Page 317 and 321: The government will impose a prohibition on hospital expansion; however, communities may petition for an exception.
**
Page 425, line 4-12: The government mandates advance-care planning consultations. Those on Social Security will be required to attend an "end-of-life planning" seminar every five years. (Death counseling..)

**
Page 429, line 13-25: The government will specify which doctors can write an end-of-life order.

HAD ENOUGH???? Judge Kithil then goes on to identify:

"Finally, it is specifically stated that this bill will not apply to members of Congress.
Honorable David Kithil of Marble Falls , Texas
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