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Why is it?
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frederick23



Joined: 24 Dec 2013
Posts: 502

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 2:32 pm    Post subject: Why is it? Reply with quote

I get the conservative fiscal argument. Makes sense mostly. But why since they are supposedly the party of freedoms and less government etc., ( I hear that on all the conservative media outlets, all of the time) are they the party telling me who I can and cannot marry (gay Marriage), whether I can have a kid or not (abortion), whether I can serve my country without prejudice, where I can put my church (mosque in TN)? Seems to me these are the most critical of freedoms and "less government" interference? Do I not get something?
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windoggie



Joined: 22 Feb 2002
Posts: 2409

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 3:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Why is it? Reply with quote

frederick23 wrote:

Do I not get something?
Nope, you get it.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 14601

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

frederick23 wrote:
I get the conservative fiscal argument. Makes sense mostly. But why since they are supposedly the party of freedoms and less government etc., ( I hear that on all the conservative media outlets, all of the time) are they the party telling me who I can and cannot marry (gay Marriage), whether I can have a kid or not (abortion), whether I can serve my country without prejudice, where I can put my church (mosque in TN)? Seems to me these are the most critical of freedoms and "less government" interference? Do I not get something?

Those constraints come primarily, some exclusively, from the FAR, uberreligious (aka bible-thumping) right fringe. I'm definitely right of center, but consider most of those ideas completely whacked. I've listened to Fox News and conservative talk radio incessantly for a dozen years now, and not one of the shows/hosts I follow supports many of those generalities.

The exceptions I see are revulsion at partial birth (at normal birth) abortions of living viable babies, general objection to earlier but late abortions of viable babies, and individual cases such as a mosque at the World Trade Center site (placing a mosque at a victory site is an organized part of their religion, and they can GD well shove that particular mosque up the Koran.) The TR host I otherwise respect most insists that official state-sanctioned marriage should be between one man and one woman, but not on religious grounds; he believes gay marriage cheapens heterosexual marriage. Even he approves the many other ways to provide legal equal rights without totally and officially equating gay hetero- and homosexual marriage under the law.

But to put that issue ahead of the future of the free world by voting strictly based on that one issue makes zero sense to me. What the heck good is a gay marriage when all gays will be stoned to death if we let let radical Islam achieve its sworn objectives?

That's not the Tea Party. That's extremist nut jobs, IMO, much like that Duck Dude or whatever he calls himself. He has a right to spout his hard core message, and everybody but the government has a comparable right to object, fire him, hate him, mock him, chase his followers away from our front doors etc. short of committing crimes against them. When they come knocking at my door on Saturday mornings, it's my choice whether to ignore them, debate them, criticize their prejudices, or tell them to get outta my face and my space. I've done all of those at one time or another, and I've told some teen-aged ones they're being brainwashed by ignorant bigots. I gotta admit, though, that I was nice to the three LDS missionaries at my door this summer; one of them was probably the most beautiful woman I've ever seen in person, maybe even on TV, and like most LDS women (I lived in Utah for seven years), all three of them were exceptionally outgoing, confident, and a pleasure to talk to.

I think -- I'm not sure -- that the gay ban in the military was intended to stifle strife in the barracks and the trenches, not to punish homosexuals. Time will tell how that and women in front line ground combat work out. I was stunned (but not surprised) when Obama gave yet another panel a year to discuss rampant sexual harassment in his military. I know exactly how I'd handle it, whether I was in the White House or any lesser military position of command -- which I was for many years. I'd issue standing orders at top volume from the rooftops that the next person or 10 or 10,000, as appropriate, convicted of sexual harassment would have the book thrown at him or her. The laws and regs are there, and any commander who does not enforce them would be punished to the fullest extent of the law. I've done that on much lesser offenses in my own little part of the military, and it was 100% effective even for years after I had moved on. If this and past presidents and lesser commanders had had 1% of the spine they should have regarding that problem, it would not be a significant problem.

Unfortunately, the right wing fringe, like its mirror image on the far left and the totally ignorant on any side, are allowed to vote. (The vote of people who can't identify Reid or Boehner or Pelosi or Romney, or who haven't heard of Benghazi or Katrina, is meaningless at best, harmful at worst, IMO. That included me until I was in my 50s, when I began paying attention and voting.)

Anyone, from the far left drones here to the rabblerousers like Al Sharpton, who actually believes the whole conservative wing thinks like its fringers, is among the ignoranuses -- the dumbasses -- who actually believe the far left screed they hear on BSNBC and the like. The same goes for the far right ignoranuses who follow their demagogues -- whomever they may be -- hook, line, and sinker, without ever checking sources.
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2760

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:

Anyone, from the far left drones here to the rabblerousers... ...fringers... ...the ignoranuses... ...the dumbasses... ...the far left screed... ...the far right ignoranuses... ...demagogues... ...hook, line, and sinker, without ever checking sources.

Merry Christmas, Mikey, and a Happy New Year!

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5555

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

without ever checking sources.

You mean like Mike's claim about conservatives and charity? Or his misquotation of Singer? It almost seemed like a rational moment from big Mike.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 720

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's really quite simple, the left wants to control and micro-manage every aspect of your daily lives and economy with more laws, red tape, taxes etc... EXCEPT...... anything to do with sex.
The left wants a complete free for all with anything regarding sex, gay stuff, bestiality, trans whatever, in the street for everyone to see, public nudity, sex on television, sex in public, and especially teach it all to children about how anything goes is the way to go!
Oh yeah and let's suck the babies out of the mothers wombs, grind them up and sell them for cosmetics and call this industry "choice".
And not to be forgotten, demonize Christians yet turn turn a blind eye to any of the outrages perpetrated by muslims upon gays, women, Christians, children, well everyone.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 5555

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another hate-filled spewing from Beagle baby--making things up to attribute to liberals. This is the same guy who called Obama by a racial slur. This is the new right. Same as the old Confederate party.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 720

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Racial slur? obongo?
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 1906
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy wrote:
Racial slur? obongo?

Yeah, they're sitting on hair triggers these days, any little thing will make them go off on any kind of attack that you'll never be able to predict.
I wouldn't want to be one of them, gotta be very careful, they are very sensitive these days.

BTW, merry Christmas BB.

_________________
I don't drink the 'cool' aid, I drink tequila, it's more honest.
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frederick23



Joined: 24 Dec 2013
Posts: 502

PostPosted: Wed Dec 25, 2013 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you are pretty much spot on Isobars. Bible thumpers. I disagree with you in that Hannity and Rush and Fox talk all the time about less government, but ignore the basics I question. I would call myself center left and have dear friends on the other side of the isle that I would take a bullet for as would they of me, so I don't understand the hate from beaglebuddy. By the way, everyone should read the new book out called An Astronauts guide to planet Earth. Really cool! Not sure I have the right stuff after reading what it's like come back to Earth on the Soyuz. I especially like the chapter "aiming to be a zero". Good tips to live life by. Everyone is either a -1, 0 or +1. Aim for zero. Read it.
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