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Drugs and the drug war
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pueno



Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2807

PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

youwindsurf wrote:

Don't you mean you smoke what you sow?

Smoke what you reap, reap what you sow.

Pass the cheese doodles, please.
.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10588

PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

reinerehlers, that article is laughable. Do you really know much about California's agricultural business and how much water is used to sustain it?

When it comes to marketing anti-marijuana propaganda, ludicrous deception and fabrications are always at the heart of it.
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KGB-NP



Joined: 25 Jul 2001
Posts: 2856

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler wrote:
reinerehlers, that article is laughable. Do you really know much about California's agricultural business and how much water is used to sustain it?

When it comes to marketing anti-marijuana propaganda, ludicrous deception and fabrications are always at the heart of it.


To be honest I don't know much about the CA agricultural business, but then I don't think I said I did. I thought the article was interesting so I posted it. An environmental awareness website is interested in propaganda, deception and fabrications?
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2643

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

'propaganda, deception and fabrication' is the stock in trade response of those who desire to smoke pot, and which overrides their acceptance of any medical studies which link long term mental damage to its habitual smoking.

It is the same failed argument as once used by the tobacco industry, in denying any link between smoking and lung cancer.

But hey, smoking pot hasn't mentally affected (???) those who do so, and nothing on earth will convince them there could be any problem!
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10588

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 1:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

G.T., so do you believe all the anti-marijuana propaganda over the years as truth? I understand that you want nothing to do with marijuana or alcohol, and that's your choice, but you shouldn't let it cloud your view of what's actually happening, particularly here in the US.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2643

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SW. - I accept bona fide medical reports which have linked severe psychiatric problems in subjects having to receive treatment because of their long term 'addiction' to pot smoking.

Why wouldn't I!
Why wouldn't you!

I don't wish to be drawn into an argument, As you say, it is now no concern of mine - but it WAS when I was teaching!
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uwindsurf



Joined: 18 Aug 2012
Posts: 968
Location: Classified

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:
'propaganda, deception and fabrication' is the stock in trade response of those who desire to smoke pot, and which overrides their acceptance of any medical studies which link long term mental damage to its habitual smoking.

It is the same failed argument as once used by the tobacco industry, in denying any link between smoking and lung cancer.

But hey, smoking pot hasn't mentally affected (???) those who do so, and nothing on earth will convince them there could be any problem!


Yeah, everybody who has ever smoked pot is a loser idiot:

Sir Richard Branson

While the ‘Sir’ in front of this guy’s name puts him in some very elite company, it doesn’t automatically get him on this list. What does earn him a spot is the fact that he’s the 236th richest person in the world, founder of the Virgin empire, which encompasses everything from airlines to record stores to cell phones, and made his entire multi-billion dollar fortune from absolutely nothing. Not only does this man smoke weed, he gets high with his 21-year-old son. He has publicly stated that there’s nothing wrong with smoking pot, has petitioned for the legalization of pot, and even said that if it were legal, he’d sell it.

Rick Steves

Your name doesn’t become synonymous with ‘European Travel’ by accident. You can’t just take a bong hit, lay back in your bean bag and toss off a few ‘graphs on how awesome the Louvre is. And yet here’s Rick Steves, author of 27 top selling European travel guides, host of his own TV show and radio show, and a very outspoken pothead. He’s a member of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws, and credits pot for turning him into a better travel writer by opening his mind to new things.

Aaron Sorkin

In fairness to tokers around the world, Sorkin is a bit more of a ‘drug addict’ than he is ‘pothead’. He started dabbling with weed and coke back in the late ’80s, has been in and out of rehab numerous times, and was arrested for possession of marijuana, mushrooms and crack in 2001. So yeah, he loves to smoke weed… but he also loves to freebase. Not cool, Aaron! However, the man’s drug problems have done little to hinder his success in Hollywood. His work on The West Wing, both as writer and producer, earned him multiple Emmy Awards, and countless nominations for other awards.

Michael Phelps

Mr. “Has More Olympic Gold Medals Than Anyone In History” made headlines this week when photos of him and a bong surfaced. Since the scandal, Phelps has given a few interviews decrying his “bad judgment,” promising it was a dumb mistake that never happened before and won’t happen again… but we know that’s bullsh*t. Phelps was hitting that bong like a pro, not daintily toking some little amateur joint. With this in mind, we’re going to go ahead and assume this wasn’t Phelps’s first time. It might be his last, but it definitely wasn’t his first. This means that you can become the most world class athlete of all time and be a pot smoker at the same time. Stereotype shattered.

Barack Obama

Almost every American President before Barry, from Washington to Clinton to Bush, has had a pot addled past. Clinton purportedly tried and failed to smoke a joint, Bush was a boozer, but messed with coke and pot from time to time, Washington even grew marijuana on his farm. But as far as we know, none have admitted to smoking as much pot as Obama. He wrote extensively about his stoner past in his book Dreams of My Father, and in a 2007 interview stated “When I was a kid I inhaled frequently. That was the point.” Anyone who wonders what kind of future a pothead can have should take a hard look at Barack Obama. Not only can you grow up to be ridiculously smart, you can grow up to be President.

Michael Bloomberg

The Mayor of New York’s last name is associated with ‘business’ and ‘success’, not ‘failure’ and ‘the munchies’. But if you’re one of those idiots who believes a pothead could never amount to anything, you’d have never guessed this was the way Bloomberg would turn out. Did he smoke pot when he was younger? In his own words “You bet I did. And I enjoyed it!”

Ted Turner

Ted is a rare breed of billionaire — he comes off as completely absent minded, incapable of even putting on his own pants. Yet he is a mega-mogul. He single-handedly invented the 24-hour news cycle with CNN, was named Time’s Man of the Year in 1991, is the largest private land owner in America, and also owns a few other TV stations, and the Atlanta Braves. So… owning lots of stuff? Not what you’d expect from a guy who grew pot in his college dorm room. Ted is also a major funder of the Kentucky Hemp Museum, along with renowned stoner Woody Harelson, and is a well known fan of the classic stoner cartoon Scooby-Doo.

Montel Williams

The talk show prince discovered pot late in life, and for good reason. Back in 1999 he was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis, and couldn’t find anything to suppress his symptoms. He tried all sorts of pain killers; none worked, and all had horrible side effects. So he decided to try medical marijuana (same thing as regular marijuana, FYI) and it worked wonders for him! Years later, he is one of MS’s most recognizable faces, one of medical marijuana’s staunchest defenders, and even though he’s baked all the time, still managed to host his own talk show until 2008, when it was unfortunately canceled. Well, at least he’s still got his weed.

Stephen King

We haven’t included many creative types on this list, mostly because they’re all potheads. Every actor, musician and artist ever is a huge pothead. It’s a fact, don’t dispute us. But writing 1,000 page novels is a slightly different process. You can’t just ‘jam out’ The Stand. Over the course of his career, both his output and his success have been unparalleled. He’s authored upwards of 50 novels and short stories which have sold a collective 500 million copies worldwide. He’s also been one of the most vocal proponents for the legalization of marijuana, calling laws against the drug “ridiculous,” and stating that “I think that marijuana should not only be legal, I think it should be a cottage industry.” It makes perfect sense. You’d have to be stoned to come up with some of the sh*t this guy has.

Arnold Schwarzenegger

The Governator is the only man on this list who is actually on video smoking weed. In the classic documentary Pumping Iron, he is seen smoking, and loving, a joint. But hey man, that was the’70s, right? Things have chanced since then. Haven’t they? Well, Schwarzenegger hasn’t been puffing since his election to office, but he has presided over California’s recent medical marijuana renaissance. Now anyone who wants one can get a pot prescription in the state, which gives them legal access to some of the best weed in the country, and even allows them to grow plants in their own home. According to Arnold, marijuana “is not a drug, it’s a leaf.”

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/grey-divider.jpg?w=600

You can include Steven Jobs, Bill Clinton and Oprah on this list as well.
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uwindsurf



Joined: 18 Aug 2012
Posts: 968
Location: Classified

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GURGLETROUSERS wrote:
SW. - I accept bona fide medical reports which have linked severe psychiatric problems in subjects having to receive treatment because of their long term 'addiction' to pot smoking.

Why wouldn't I!
Why wouldn't you!

I don't wish to be drawn into an argument, As you say, it is now no concern of mine - but it WAS when I was teaching!


I could probably find studies discussing people with serious psychiatric problems having to receive treatment because of their long term 'addiction' to masturbation. Should that be outlawed as well?
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10588

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

G.T., not to draw you in further, but what do you think about all the ads we see across the media spectrum about prescription drugs? Without exception, they all include terrible warnings of possible impacts and reactions as part of the ads. Many of them highlight a risk of death.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 17736
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Sun Apr 20, 2014 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ya know, everyone is right a little bit, and nobody is listening. Drugs are one of those unsolvable problems. As long as American's with money are buying drugs, someone will make money selling them. The best estimates we have are that the war on drugs interdicted about 8-10% of drugs, and spent trillions. It normalized jail for two generation of kids in poor neighborhoods, without materially affecting either the supply or cost of drugs. And it brought the Mexican Mafia into the growing and smuggling of marijuana. They, in turn, displaced local growers in places like Mendocino and Humboldt County, and the level of violence went up dramatically. Were there any lessons from prohibition that we forgot?

I agree with GT that I don't want to see drugs more available to kids, even pot has adverse impacts on the developing mind. But it is patently obvious that what we have tried is neither sustainable nor effective. Perhaps all we can do is manage the problem, and hope that the culture discourages, rather than encourages, simplistic solutions.

I have known adults who have smoked marijuana for decades, including high powered attorneys that showed no ill effects, and others who seemed to lose their sense of initiative. No simple answers here, except that there is a difference between recreational behavior and addictive behavior--and it is impossible to stop with enforcement.
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