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I need a really big sail
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 5966

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy,

Have you thought about launching at the Y Camp, particularly if you're going to be using bigger fins. The areas of dry reef can be a bit intimating, but they're not as tough to navigate as spots like Anini Beach where the barrier reef can be hard to find a clear pathway in and out. Also, the Y Camp picks up the summer trade winds much better than middle of the bay at Hanalei. The key to sailing at the Y Camp is not sailing to far out. The waves there can be fun too because they're in close to shore, and you're less likely to run into shallow reef.
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rangerider



Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 161

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use my Lion 9.5 on lighter wind days with the WindSup 11'8" and with my Ultrasonic. The sail is a good pairing for both boards in appropriate winds. You will plane earlier on the more "formula-like" board. I do think the sail handles wind lulls very well but it is definitely hard to gybe - then again I'm not any good at gybing yet - rotation of the sail takes a bit of work and the sail has a deep draft which wants to pull me over in the turn. The sail is good looking and durable and has been my most used sail the last 2 years. The thing that really impressed me at first was how stable and easy to control it is in gusts and when overpowered. I am happy with the sail but I would love to have a chance to compare it to the cheetah or a retro 9.5 to see how much difference the cams make both to the positive and negative.
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Brian.bigfella@gmail.com



Joined: 11 Jun 2012
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy wrote:
Brian.bigfella@gmail.com wrote:
I'm a super-heavyweight (280 pounds) and my Lion 9.5

it has a really long boom (about 250).


Specs say 240 to 247, we know Ezzy's take a lot of outhaul is it more like 247 to 250? My boom is the Chinook pro alloy 185-247, I wonder if is long AND deep enough?


I was originally using a 185-247 but I ended up bending it during a 20 knot session at Cabrillo. You're lighter than I am, and it will work fine, but I do think the 225-285 feels more solid even though it weighs as much as a small house.

If the 9.5 ends up being your go to sail you're probably going to end up wanting to go full carbon, just like I am. In steady wind that big, heavy rig is fine. But in gusty conditions it's a beast. I had a chance to pop a carbon boom on it last summer and it made a huge difference. The weight difference makes it easier to jibe as well.

I'd recommend getting the sail and using it for a while. Yes, you're going to plane super early. And as a bonus it has a huge range, you'll be able to sail it into the mid-teens.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 719

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Swchandler, until I can start making most of my jibes I need to stay on flat water in a lagoon or bay. Ultimately Haena is the place to sail because that's where the consistent wind is. I was getting fairly proficient and starting to work on the high speed jibe (the entry at least) but last year was a washout with a lack of wind, injury and work. I need the big sail to get time on the water so I can work on technique.
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beaglebuddy



Joined: 10 Feb 2012
Posts: 719

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose what I am getting at is how important are cambers for light wind?
The Hot sail will rig 100% correct, jibe easier, waterstart a bit easier and is .5M larger.
The cambered Ezzy will ***probably*** rig well enough that I won't be able to notice a difference, the luff sleeve is kept reasonably small so waterstarting will be a bit more difficult (how much?) Jibes a bit more problematic (don't need this) weight is fairly close, the big question is which sail will be more powerful in marginal conditions and are the cambers worth it?
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Brian.bigfella@gmail.com



Joined: 11 Jun 2012
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have an 8.5 Cheetah and a 9.5 Lion. Here are my thoughts on the difference.

The Lion rotates well, that hasn't been a issue. It rigs pretty quickly, but getting the cams on and back off is what it is. The Lion's range is huge, when you really crank it down you can take it out in really strong wind. When it's gusty it has a much easier time handling the ups and downs. It really isn't a matter of wind strength, but more a matter of steadiness.

The Cheetah is super easy to rig. In lighter wind I have it loose and it's not as comfortable as the Lion. Its got a lighter "feel" as opposed to the locked in feel of the Lion. Where it really shines is in stronger (17+) steady wind when I have it rigged tight. It's stable but lively and just a blast to sail.

An example would be last Saturday at Cabrillo. It was slightly gustier than normal and I was on my 8.5 Cheetah. I had to be really active to sail it and I got tired pretty quick. Had it been a Lion I would have been able to just sit back in the harness a little more, that would have been a better choice FOR THAT DAY.

So I think the question is, when you say light are you talking a 12-15 day? Then you could go camless and be super happy. If light means 10-20 then I'd go with a two cam.

By the way, I was intimidated by waterstarting a 9.5 sail with cams, but it isn't too hard. Harder than a no cam, yes. But nothing that can't be done.
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whitevan01



Joined: 29 Jun 2007
Posts: 508

PostPosted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the Dagger is a great sail, esp. on a board with a c/b like your Kona One. I have 7.5 Dagger for my Megacat. It's a great combo.
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Sailboarder



Joined: 10 Apr 2011
Posts: 470

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brian.bigfella@gmail.com wrote:

So I think the question is, when you say light are you talking a 12-15 day? Then you could go camless and be super happy. If light means 10-20 then I'd go with a two cam.


Thanks, this statement is quite clear. It confirms my own choice. Hope it will help the OP too.
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coachg



Joined: 10 Sep 2000
Posts: 2019

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

beaglebuddy,

I have both cam and non-cammed sails, switching back & forth between them quite often. I won't part with my cammed sails for anything in the right conditions. For your situation I would recommend the non-cam sail.

You are working on jibes-much easier without cams.

You are sailing in a relatively small area-lots of sail handling so easier without cams.

You will likely be jibing in marginal wind-cam rotation hassle if you don't jibe in a gust.

Your mast may not be a great fit for the cammed sail-cam rotation hassle.

Cam sails are really best for situations where you won't need to handle them very often and are sailing powered to overpowered conditions where you may need to go high into or far off of the wind.

By the way, have you tried sailing at Port Allen or Nawiliwili Harbor for windsurfing? Or is it too far from where you live? I know traffic through Kapaa can be crazy at the wrong time but those two locations get pretty good wind with relatively flat water do to man made shore breaks and they have pretty good wind which is why they locate the airports there.

Coachg
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thombiz



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 618
Location: Corpus Christi

PostPosted: Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If anyone is interested, I have a MauiSails TR2 10.2 sail I would give to someone Free. The catch is...no shipping. You have to pick it up here in Corpus Christi. I understand it was one of Phil McGains personal race sails way back when. It is actually in pretty good condition. In the right hands, it probably has a couple years of life remaining. It rigs on a 520 mast and requires a seriously long boom. I have a highly modified old school Gulftech carbon boom I would throw in for an additional $125. PM me if interested.
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