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Kiter hit by a car in San Francisco
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hemmy007



Joined: 10 May 2002
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mac wrote:

And, like Andy, I would like to know the condition of the fellow that was hurt.



while I have not seen it confirmed anywhere online,
the top SFBay kite instructor told us yesterday
that the gentleman did not make it.

will look for confirming info online to confirm.

RIP & condolences to his friends & family.
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kevinkan



Joined: 07 Jun 2001
Posts: 1661
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hemmy007 wrote:
mac wrote:

And, like Andy, I would like to know the condition of the fellow that was hurt.



while I have not seen it confirmed anywhere online,
the top SFBay kite instructor told us yesterday
that the gentleman did not make it.

will look for confirming info online to confirm.

RIP & condolences to his friends & family.


Sad indeed. I heard the same news yesterday, but I have not been able to confirm.

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Kevin Kan
Sunset Sailboards, San Francisco CA
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mogunn



Joined: 03 Apr 2006
Posts: 1307
Location: SF Bay

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sad news indeed!
I was out at 3rd that afternoon. The wind was volatile - huge gusts with sudden 40 degree wind shifts. The coast was even worse. Not the place for someone unfamiliar with or unprepared for the conditions.
Condolences to his family and friends.

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mo
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summertime



Joined: 16 Jun 2006
Posts: 89

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, so sad to hear the guy may not have made it.
I had to chime in that I learn a ton from isobars and zirtab so keep posting! We are lucky to have those 2 with so much knowledge and experiences to share. I love their input! Koogzah- if you have something interesting to say - chime in- if you are jealous of other's people for having something to share- work on that! Being jealous is wasted energy you could put toward enjoying your life and then having your own stories to share. Also- this discussion about the safety of kiting is a valuable discussion. I sometime think about taking up kiting just to have another option but discussions like these make me realize that it isn't really a good sport for me. Also, sometimes people that don't do either sport ask me about taking up WS ing and kiting. I have always suggested WSing over kiting primarily because of the safety issue. This sad incident and this discussion validate that point of view for me.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hemmy007 wrote:
when I see people launching kites,lofting kites in the parking lot at C.F. launching LIT just up wind of kids & people picnic-ing, people hucking over kids learning to WS with their parents

it is clearly not me being ANTI those sports

he was a newbie ... totally preventable.

Yes, if someone violates the PC code and informs people like him that kiting can be dangerous in 20-40kt onshore winds. But NOOOOOOOOO ... we're anti-kiters if we do that. Heaven forbid someone speaks the truth.

Sheeee-it!

Thanks, Summertime. I'm glad someone here has some sense.

Just one question ... well, two plus a comment ... for those parents:
1. WTH are are they thinking in not eliminating the danger to their kids any way they can?
2. Who is that spot generally relegated to ... the kids or the kites?
3. If the parents won't correct the problem, other observers should call the police and Child Protective Services and let them decide who's at fault ... the parents, the kiters, or both. Simply because of the danger THEY are imposing, the kiters are clearly guilty of reckless endangerment. Whether the parents are also at fault depends on the local laws and customs.
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 6485
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kinda late on this thread, really sorry that another kiter died, and sorry for his family.
While reading thru this thread, I saw this and couldn't get it out of my mind.
WATUPWITU wrote:

Can I make windsurfing more dangerous than kiting? of course

Just wondering how this could be achieved.
Sailing blindfolded thru a busy shipping lane?
Adding razor blades to the booms?
Grovelling very slowly thru a bunch of sharks towing a dead turkey?
I just don't get it.

Not trying to make light of the situation, I've got two friends in wheelchairs because of kiting.
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windfind



Joined: 18 Mar 1997
Posts: 1902

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Gang,

First sincere condolences to the family and friends of this visiting kiter. And to all of us windsurfers and kiters who lost a fellow waterman who died pursuing his passion for the wind.

Second, I know the Bay Area forecasts are far from perfect but there is one dangerous Bay Area wind pattern I unfortunately nail 100% of the time. It occurs when there is a rare perfect storm of powerful NW surface wind accompanied by wild gusts and shifts as WSW winds just aloft randomly crash to the surface. In this patten steady mid 20’s NW wind are punctuated by near instantaneous 30-40 degree wind shifts and 10-20 knot velocity changes. When there is a high probability of such a pattern I insert the words: “It may be dangerous to launch kites at times today at some sites”

I am not a chicken little. I have issued that phrase in the forecast 3 times in the last decade. Two of those times kiters died at Ocean Beach and the other time a kiter friend suffered serious injuries at 3rd. Ave. as they were lofted and crashed. It hits you hard when people read your words to help make a decision to hit the water and are hurt or die. Please, if you see that phrase in a forecast use extreme caution and mention it to others.

Lastly, in the winter my house overlooks one of the most popular kite launches in Baja. Watching from my deck and the beach since the advent of kiting I have probably seen more kitemares than almost anyone especially in the early days of the sport. And I could go on and on about the risks vs. the thrills of kiting.

But THIS particular forum is not the place for such a discussion. A fellow waterman was hurt and died. His family, friends and significant other are probably reading your words in this forum trying to understand what happened. Comments disparaging his chosen passion are simply not appropriate here.

I suggest you start a new thread to discuss your thoughts about your perception of the dangers of kiting. Or better yet, since this is a windsurfing forum, go to one of the many kiting forums and express your concerns. Leave this forum thread for condolences to a fallen comrade.

Thank you,

Mike Godsey



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stonefly



Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Mike.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20935

PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

windfind wrote:
But THIS particular forum is not the place for such a discussion.

Admirable sentiments, Mike, but there's a flip side to the coin.

The cancer forums I'm in include some people who believe the forums' sole purpose is to administer solace. They try to thwart anything but "Oh, you'll be fine." One wife (of many wives in the forums) gleefully reported that her husband had gone into a hospice, but was expected to be released soon. She thought that meant he would be fine ... not dead. We had to break it to her what a hospice is and definitely is not.

No, they won't be fine. All will suffer and many of them will die, often due to bad decisions borne of patients' and/or doctors' ignorance. The other 80% or so in the forums want advice and facts on heavy medical science (some leading oncologists are in the forums), impotence, incontinence, treatment options, their side effects (which are often worse than the disease), cure likelihoods, risk factors, doing nothing, and MUCH more. I know of two who left the forums because they couldn't deal with the realities of the disease.

We of the 80% have prevented dozens of HUGE medical mistakes, and have opened hundreds of eyes to those and more aspects of dealing with cancer. I caught a lot of flak when I foisted the realities of treatment side effects upon the forums a decade ago. Now physicians worldwide are coming around to acknowledging that -- to closely paraphrase a leading oncologist regarding some forms and hundreds of thousands of cases of cancer -- "most treatment decisions should be based on their side effects rather than their cure potential, because the former is MUCH more certain".

Doesn't the chance to save a few naive kiters and bystanders from unnecessary harm justify discussing the realities of kiting vs WSing whenever the topic arises, the consequences are vivid, and the interest is piqued? My experience with introducing side effects in hundreds of cancer treatment discussions, where the duration and quality of many lives matter every day, says, "Yes."

The primary difference in this forum is that the cause of the threat is more obvious, more preventable, and can be alleviated even after it's diagnosed, even if it's nothing more than taking WATUPWITU's advice to engage one's brain before launching.
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 17748
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like Ben said, it's got to be all about Mike.
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