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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2226
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey Gary,

They are indeed a very high cant with a fair amount of toe in. Probably
a lot more that you put into your custom work. I wouldn't have guessed
I'd want that much, but Hinde knows his stuff, and the concept (for
whatever reason, works in the conditions I use it in). I had him plant some
of those side fins and boxes into a HiTech (after a lot of pleading, so don't
expect him to do that for everybody), and the board went from a 3.2/3.7
board to a 3.2 to 4.7 board, so something magic is going on, or maybe I
just got lucky with the HiTech planform.

And yes, the side fin box is a little strange, a bit like a surfinz/fcs box, but
with single fixing point on an Allen screw. I've never had any issues with
mine, and they get ridden a lot, but I'm not sure they are compatible
with any of those standard surfing fins.

-Craig

U2U2U2 wrote:
Craig,
I remember something about the side fins, of course the very high cant,

And the box is different?


Last edited by cgoudie1 on Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2226
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm with John on this also. I don't much care to slog, and I've gotten in
a lot more trouble by under rigging than over rigging in the Gorge, so,
if you're in doubt, rig big. Not much for listening to the fussing on the
beach either, rather be on the water.

And it is easier to fall in love with a board designed for the conditions
you're in (no surprise there) vs conditions on your home turf, so be wary,
but, ........my experience is that the new shape OOs require less sail
power than the old ones, and so are a little more general purpose.
Mine in particular is a great swell surfer, and can be ridden luffed, but
it doesn't have enough nose kick for real waves. You could have that
built into a board for you though, because they can be custom tailored
to your style and site, if you know what that is.

.02

-Craig

jingebritsen wrote:


as long as one realizes that gusty conditions prevail in the gorge, and one should apply lots of sail power for the lulls, one should be happy to have a gorge board like that. NOTE: when i am in the ditch, and several people tell me they are on 4.2's and i watch them slog half the time, i know it's time for a 5.0 to 5.5 sail.... coming from my world, that's a happy rig. to lots there, they would rather sit on the river bank and moan.

another note: lotsa people fall in love with a board in the gorge or maui, buy one for home use and rarely end up using them. that's a southeast coast perspective.
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kmf



Joined: 02 Apr 2001
Posts: 493

PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have owned two Open Oceans, each was built custom for me. Sold my first one a few years ago, purchased the second one in the winter of 2014, and it is a great board. Works perfectly for me....7'10" 78 litres or so....built in a closed cell light tech. I use it in the gorge, 3.4 to ....4.7 good range, exactly what I wanted.

If you know what you need, Brian can build it for you.

KMF
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noshuzbluz



Joined: 18 May 2000
Posts: 791

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The OO website update will hopefully happen this week. Sorry for the delay. I've had some technical issues that need to be resolved.
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The Time a Person Spends Windsurfing is not Deducted from their Lifespan...
http://www.openocean.com
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19023

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cgoudie1 wrote:
They are indeed a very high cant with a fair amount of toe in. Probably a lot more that you put into your custom work. I wouldn't have guessed I'd want that much, but Hinde knows his stuff, and the concept (for
whatever reason, works in the conditions I use it in).

Let's give credit where it's due ... again.

Those fin shapes and angles were developed by the Campbell Brothers after years of research a LOOONG time ago and remained proprietary. Gorge Animal owner and 40-year-shaper Lester "Polyester" Crighton bought a license from the Campbells to use the Bonzer fin, configuration, and name in his breakthrough "Bonzer" boards back in the '80s. There was a big and lengthy flap among Gorge Animal, The Campbells, and OO when OO just "up and started using their proprietary layout" without a license.
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 5013
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cgoudie1 wrote:
Hey Gary,

They are indeed a very high cant with a fair amount of toe in. Probably
a lot more that you put into your custom work. I wouldn't have guessed
I'd want that much, but Hinde knows his stuff, and the concept (for
whatever reason, works in the conditions I use it in). I had him plant some
of those side fins and boxes into a HiTech (after a lot of pleading, so don't
expect him to do that for everybody), and the board went from a 3.2/3.7
board to a 3.2 to 4.7 board, so something magic is going on, or maybe I
just got lucky with the HiTech planform.

And yes, the side fin box is a little strange, a bit like a surfinz/fcs box, but
with single fixing point on an Allen screw. I've never had any issues with
mine, and they get ridden a lot, but I'm not sure they are compatible
with any of those standard surfing fins.

-Craig

U2U2U2 wrote:
Craig,
I remember something about the side fins, of course the very high cant,

And the box is different?


The box sounds like a Futures , a surf box. Which if , as assuredly so Are installed soundly, are plenty strong for small side fins. I have gone to mostly slot boxes, but still use PROBOX , they have a insert for the fin, that is interchangeable for Zero up to I think 8 degree of cant, I have never played that much with them, maybe this spring.


Be curious to find out the OO fin box if anyone knows.

_________________
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4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2226
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So a bit of contention then. I know nothing about what came from where,
but I'm always glad that progress is made, and it's rare that a design
spontaneously erupts. I've never owned a Bonzer, but they were way
ahead of their time (the wider rear biased planform was very similar to
production boards today). Just to contrast though, Bonzers were Bonzers
because of 5 fins, and the original Bonzers had channels between each fin
(think of that as maybe a quadcave around the fin area). In fact, my
recollection was that the origin of the 5 fins was as you say a surfing
invention in New Zealand I think. Anyway, the OOs were/are 3 fins,
originally quite narrow, and I don't remember seeing any channels between
the fins on the early models, but I'm sure Brian would build you anything
you wanted. The toe in and cant on an OO does look similar to the
Bonzer toe in and cant. Don't know if that was appropriated or not, but the
overall boards were pretty different originally.

Anyway, I'm happy to give the Campbell brothers (or anybody else who
makes my sailing more enjoyable) credit. If someone wants to find
Les and give him a Bonzer order, I think he's down in South America these days.

-Craig

isobars wrote:
cgoudie1 wrote:
They are indeed a very high cant with a fair amount of toe in. Probably a lot more that you put into your custom work. I wouldn't have guessed I'd want that much, but Hinde knows his stuff, and the concept (for
whatever reason, works in the conditions I use it in).

Let's give credit where it's due ... again.

Those fin shapes and angles were developed by the Campbell Brothers after years of research a LOOONG time ago and remained proprietary. Gorge Animal owner and 40-year-shaper Lester "Polyester" Crighton bought a license from the Campbells to use the Bonzer fin, configuration, and name in his breakthrough "Bonzer" boards back in the '80s. There was a big and lengthy flap among Gorge Animal, The Campbells, and OO when OO just "up and started using their proprietary layout" without a license.
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2226
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd better mention to you that it's the fin roots on the OO fins that provide
the cant. the boxes are vertical, and don't appear to have any cant adjustment.

-Craig

U2U2U2 wrote:
cgoudie1 wrote:
Hey Gary,

They are indeed a very high cant with a fair amount of toe in. Probably
a lot more that you put into your custom work. I wouldn't have guessed
I'd want that much, but Hinde knows his stuff, and the concept (for
whatever reason, works in the conditions I use it in). I had him plant some
of those side fins and boxes into a HiTech (after a lot of pleading, so don't
expect him to do that for everybody), and the board went from a 3.2/3.7
board to a 3.2 to 4.7 board, so something magic is going on, or maybe I
just got lucky with the HiTech planform.

And yes, the side fin box is a little strange, a bit like a surfinz/fcs box, but
with single fixing point on an Allen screw. I've never had any issues with
mine, and they get ridden a lot, but I'm not sure they are compatible
with any of those standard surfing fins.

-Craig

U2U2U2 wrote:
Craig,
I remember something about the side fins, of course the very high cant,

And the box is different?


The box sounds like a Futures , a surf box. Which if , as assuredly so Are installed soundly, are plenty strong for small side fins. I have gone to mostly slot boxes, but still use PROBOX , they have a insert for the fin, that is interchangeable for Zero up to I think 8 degree of cant, I have never played that much with them, maybe this spring.


Be curious to find out the OO fin box if anyone knows.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19023

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cgoudie1 wrote:
Bonzers were Bonzers because of 5 fins, and the original Bonzers had channels between each fin (think of that as maybe a quadcave around the fin area). ... the
overall boards were pretty different originally.

If someone wants to find Les and give him a Bonzer order ...

Les left Bonzer production rights along with hull shape and fin-mount templates with Cascade in Mosier. I had Cascade build me 2 or 3 Bonzers. They held up under me for 4 or 5 sessions before total hull failure Cascade could not repair. My next half dozen Gorge Animal Bonzers came from swap meets with Campbell's signature IN the board and Campbell's/Les's channels among the fins. They came in MANY nose and tail shapes over the years, each with its own pros and cons, but all had the classic Bonzer fin style, placement, and angles.

As for " the overall boards were pretty different originally" ... yup. So were and are their performances.
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noshuzbluz



Joined: 18 May 2000
Posts: 791

PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote=Be curious to find out the OO fin box if anyone knows.[/quote]

Yes they're Futures

_________________
The Time a Person Spends Windsurfing is not Deducted from their Lifespan...
http://www.openocean.com
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