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Robby bring the Chopper Back
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RUMREEFWARRIOR



Joined: 20 Jul 2000
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great stuff "jingebritsen", I agree with everything you just said.
But putting the chopper in that category of "very specific gear" well that's not really accurate. Its good at everything, but speed sailing, duh, and its just as stable as any 5 batten.
In your story I would be right next to you with my XL chopper and 100L+ wave board, Except I would be way more maneuverable on the wave. +++
I used to be a diehard 6.2M-5 batten wave sailor myself, that is until the chopper came along, and made wave sailing way more fun.
That being said, probably the chopper would not be for you jingebritsen, as you have your stuff very dialed in for your area, it would be very hard to change that.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3308

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i would want minimal battens too IF i had access to ideal conditions with ideal wind speeds, ideal wind angles to waves, etc.

el nino years in an ideal spot like lowers, 3 batten sails suck. tiny boards with tiny sails suck. i sailed in between dozens of sailors with my 5 batten 6.2 sail and a 102 liter free ride board. twisted all over the waves that the bob and schloggers couldn't get to in time. i could grab any wave at will, because i was planing into the right position at every wave peak i spotted.

who gives one fugg about who might be a bit more twisty on a wave if you can't get them to begin with. capice?

no, 3 batten sails are not as stable as 5's, period. been there done that. those that say otherwise are not applying the scientific method. just self deluding....
or, believing the propaganda.

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Last edited by jingebritsen on Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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RUMREEFWARRIOR



Joined: 20 Jul 2000
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jingebritsen you do know the Naish Chopper is a 4-batten right?
And I agree with you on 3 batten sails, As I stated in my article.

With the chopper being so dang short all it needs is 4 battens.
It has the same power and stability as most 5 battens out there, that's why it is so awesome.

Still I compare the XL chopper with 5.7 power, A 6.2 will have more juice no doubt. When its not enough for the XL chopper I go to the 7.5, its a perfect gap for myself.
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rollerrider



Joined: 17 May 2003
Posts: 100

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems like these sails were not on the market long enough to be given a fair chance. I remember looking at this sail and thinking no way, too radical, wouldn't take the chance of buying one. Maybe others thought the same so it didn't sell well. If it was available a few more years it maybe it would have become more popular if it was as good as it's supposed to be.
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westender



Joined: 02 Aug 2007
Posts: 1168
Location: Portland / Gorge

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a consumer, sounds like a great deal, especially if you're not worried about top speed? I would see them on the water and was curious. They make more money selling you a greater number of masts and sails. You have to make a profit.
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leto



Joined: 09 Jan 2013
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RUMREEFWARRIOR, I wonder if your "Robby bring the Chopper back" thread disappeared from boards.co.uk. I posted there but cannot find the thread anymore.
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 5906
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From your blog:
"Look is the chopper the best sail for onshore wave? No. Is it the best for sideshore wave? No. Is it the best for down the line waves? No. Is it the best for bump and jump? No. Is it the fastest sail? Definitely not. Is it the most stable sail? Nope. Is it the best freestyle sail? No. Is it the lightest sail? No.  Look The Chopper would not win an award for best sail in any technical category, but yet it would be right up there near the top of every single one."

IMO, that is a very honest description, with the exception of the very last statement.
Those are not good for any kind of wave sailing, whenever you shorten the sails height (or mast length) you have to make up the lost area someplace else, as in the boom length, which is what they did.
Long booms on the waves are a pain, and has nothing to do with what kind of wind. They make everything on the waves more difficult, that clew sticking out there, hitting the water when you don't want it to, is a big price to pay for the convenience of a shorter mast.

Basically when you have an all-around board or sail, that usually means they are not prefect for anything. But I will give you this, they would be good for those all-around sailors, who aren't interested in being an expert or even advanced at any one discipline. I personally don't know of any of those people.
But that's just me, as per your original request for feedback.
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UncleRandy



Joined: 18 Sep 2009
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the chopper rig system is a great idea. But I think a lot of people are like me and didn't give give them a try because they don't own a 370 mast. I have sails down to 4.2 and the smallest mast I use is a 400. So to try a chopper that met I would have to spend more $$ for a new mast to.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3308

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

north tried the "one mast for all" schtick. it stank. larger sizes, the whole kit suffered, massively.

noodle-like masts limit the wind range of any given sail, UNLESS one designs a sail with sheeeeeet loads of luff curve, which makes for crappy cornering.

don't believe me? use the scientific method, and find out for yourself.

_________________
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www.iwindsurf.com
http://www.epicgearusa.com/
http://www.seanski.com/
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RUMREEFWARRIOR



Joined: 20 Jul 2000
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not going to get too technical, cause I am not a sail designer. Otherwise I would just be making my own, and selling them to all the peeps who want them. But the Chopper is a High Performance Wave sail. I am very very critical about my equipment, if it wasn't the best performing sail, I wouldn't be riding it. I know they have tried the one mast concept in the past and it might not have worked, but Naish figured it out on the chopper! at least up to 5.5-5.7 size power. They are the opposite of a floppy sail. Probably the tightest, most powerful with huge range, wave slicing sail I have ever used to date. The boom is only about 5cm larger in the 2 lager sizes, then a normal wave sail. The 2 smaller sizes I would say are probably actually smaller boom size. The bottom sail cut is high, I have never stuck the clew in a wave, and trust me I know how to ride a Wave or too. Wink The chopper sail is very Unconventional in everyway. I am sure that's why a lot of sailors looked the other way. But the sail just works. That's why lots of sailors new and old who have tried them or own them. would like to buy a quiver of them. I am hopeful Naish will start making them again, and maybe put some more R&D into it, to make them even better. There is a market for them.
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