Question about boards for foiling

[pmlct]

I want to start looking for a used board to crash and burn on as I learn to foil. My questions are 1) Is a tuttle box considered to be the best choice for foiling or is a powerbox and plate adaptor equal in strength? 2) Does board weight matter much ie is a heavier/more durable board a good idea or does the extra weight stress the fin box even more? Thank you in advance for whatever info you can provide.

[NOVAAN]

Call windance board shop in the Gorge. They started foiling last year and will have some info on that power box plate. I am thinking the same as you for lite wind. Many of the board brands are coming out with a foil and board combo. Naish is one of them. It might be easier with a set up designed to foil with the proper foil and box set up...Kind of expensive...I might sell my new 2017 3s 116, a great lite wind board for the Naish set up shortly

[kevinkan]

most windsurf boards' fin boxes are not equipped to handle the load of a foil and will eventually fail. there are two problems associated with this:

1 - you break the fin box on your board... not to terrible if you're using a disposable board

2 - you break the fin box on your board and lose the foil. this has happened to a few people I know. at this point the foils are more expensive than the board, so this is worth considering

If you're handy with board repair/building, you can reinforce the inbox of your existing board. a board builder friend of mine is right now very busy replacing/reinforcing fin boxes for foiling

Less expensive foils are hitting the market this year. One way to do this is with extruded aluminum masts (the vertical fin component of the foil). Slingshot actually makes a full setup that comes w/ three mast lengths with which to progress. Start w/ the short mast and work your way up.

[skyking1231]

There is still little information about what size sail and wind to get up on a foil. Just lookg for a general idea. I figure the volume of the board, really determines how stabke you want to be when not on the foil...shclogging it, or maybe uphauling sail? But it apperas width of board is important. Obviously the size of foil will come into play.

Definitley interestd in foils. But not ready to buy pne just yet.

[grantmac017]

[U2U2U2]

Tuttle must surely be stronger.

Kevin brings up a good point, I would worry about losing a very expensive foil.

I , if inclined, and I ain't, would look for a used kite foil and adapt to a board.

Advise on the particular board would need to come from a user, not theory's

[Wind-NC.com]

Hi there,

First, I wouldn't be too worried about trashing your board. Yes, you will fall while learning to foil, but the falls aren't really that dramatic. Most of them are slow rolling falls. They make a big splash due to your starting height but if you've generally outgrown catapulting and smashing noses, then I don't see any reason why you would suddenly start doing it with frequency again.

Of course, $hit happens, but I wouldn't be super worried about it if you already know how to windsurf.

Regarding the fin boxes- The foiling boxes are made out of full carbon, and then are usually reinforced in the board with extra layers of sheet and pour foam, carbon or glass, etc etc. Here is an example of the foiling box:

http://shop.fiberglasssupply.com/Sailboard_Mast_Fin_Box-4in_Flanged_Tuttle_Fin_Box_W_1.html

This is as opposed to the standard tuttle (or power or US) boxes which are made out of plastic:

http://shop.fiberglasssupply.com/Sailboard_Mast_Fin_Box-Chinook_-Tuttle-_Plastic_Race.html


So if you do retro fit an existing board, you'll probably be spending about $100 on materials if you do it yourself, or I would expect a board builder to charge you about $200 - $300 to do it for you.

There are already some freerace and slalom boards on the market that are coming with pre-built fin boxes that are strong enough for foiling. I would anticipate many many more brands to be doing this in the future.


As far as foils sinking goes- Ouch, bummer!! Well, some foils do sink, and some don't. AHD's AFS-1 has about 10 liters of float. Most of the heavier aluminum ones will probably sink. And I would think that the full carbon, really thin mast and fuselage race foils will probably be sinkers too, due to their low volume. Best to check before you get into deep water, though, especially if you haven't reinforced your board yet


And then as far as general info goes.... Just like fins need to match sails and boards, foils have a similar relationship. The responsive, playful, high lift foils match up well with really light relatively small freestyle and wave sails and an upright stance. The super thin, low drag, race foils match up better with larger, locked and loaded race or freeride sails and a more powerful "hiked out" stance. Hiked out is all relative, by the way.

The board and sail combo needs to get you up to 6-12knots of forward speed before the foil takes over. So flat rocker and boxy rail boards will accelerate a bit better in light winds. The width is a big advantage while flying because you do need to get pretty far out away from the centerline to help control the foil and keep the board flat.

In any case, you can ride whatever you want and I guarantee that you'll have a smile on your face, just like the early days of windsurfing. And then if you want to get more specific and really dial your gear in, then go for it! But you don't have to in order to enjoy yourself out there. If you already have a 120-150 liter freeride board, start with that and get a strong tuttle box installed. Or go ahead and splurge and get something super sweet that is purpose built and already dialed in. Either way, you will be stoked!

[U2U2U2]

Wind NYC wrote..

So if you do retro fit an existing board, you'll probably be spending about $100 on materials if you do it yourself, or I would expect a board builder to charge you about $200 - $300 to do it for you.

The link for the foil Tuttle shows a cost for the box at $72 + delivery.. I think I could install this myself for the $100, because I have epoxy, carbon, Kevlar , and glass.

Consider the cost of a foil , $749 + delivery , for a inexpensive one.

I saw foils in Berkeley in 1999, maybe it's a Millennial thing now

[pmlct]

After reading more forums and researching this I see that Deep Tuttle boxes are the standard along with four bolt plates as another way. There should be a flange all around the base of the tuttle insert or you need to make a spacer out of wood or better to fill the cavity at the top of the tuttle insert inside the finbox. The force of the foil is mostly upwards against the board and the tuttle insert will split apart the finbox on a regular windsurf board as it wedges further into the box. The flange or plate mount will avoid this problem. The plate mount is a kite standard and would need two parallel finboxes or it would bolt right up to the powerplate that Windance is offering. The Powerplate will also prevent the finbox insert from wedging into the finbox, along with providing fore/aft adjustment since windsurf boards might have the finbox a little further back than foil boards. The aluminum foil masts that I am seeing appear to have permanently attached Deep Tuttle tops , mostly with no flange. This means you can't use it on powerbox or regular tuttle boards or switch to a 4 bolt plate if you wanted.

What is making sense to me so far is to go with a 4 bolt plate and attach it to the powerplate system and buy the different adaptors for the powerplate. This will allow you to attach the foil to any of the through hull finbox systems.

I bought a used Bic Nova with a padded deck, multiple footstrap positions and a deep tuttle box for $150. It is 120 liters, 66 wide, length unknown.
I think it will be a good first board for this and maybe a forever board since I won't put 4K into this.

Also check out clearwater foils. It is a wood kit that you glass or carbon over yourself for $125 or you can buy it already done for $350. So far that is the least expensive option out there.

I will order the powerplate shortly and then start the hunt for a foil system.
If any of the above is wrong please set me straight. Thanks

[NOVAAN]

Bic boards do not use power box fins. power plate won't work. I talked with Eva the board lady about the power plate add. She thought it should work fine on power box boards