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Is foiling the future of light wind windsurfing?
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 757

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:48 am    Post subject: Is foiling the future of light wind windsurfing? Reply with quote

Lovely foilers,

8-20 knots on 4.2/5.0. Hard to get overpowered since sails are so small, therefore increase wind range. Are sensations similar to planing? Is it satisfying repetitively or just the first time and that's it kind of thing?

Does it simplify the learning curve? Is it easier physically? Does it smooth out nasty water state? Is it manageable over breaking waves? Onshore?

How much windsurfing skill required? Why so slow to pick up?

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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3237

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

more gear, OR more different gear.

try selling your largest sail/mast/boom. it's the most expensive per piece. write off the loss, or use it to death.

then add the expense of a specific board and foil. heard that some people are breaking race boards that are not specifically reinforced for foiling.

how to make a hard sport harder????

selling more expensive/specific stuff to save the sport????? definition of insanity: keep trying to do the same thing, the more expensive gizmo, and expecting different results.

save the sport? planing long boards for surf that blast around great too, if the wind picks up. x-longboard 11'5"

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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 3859
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

At 8-20 knots, I'm on a 5.2, at 160 lbs., and depending on slog or how bad the "8" is, maybe a 85 liter board.
Now, talking 8-12 knots, a foil would be a good idea, usually with a 90 cm or 100 cm board, and 6.5 meter sail for a 160 lbs'er.
That would require a 160 lbs advanced freeride sailor to need a 75 cm wide lightweight slalom board and a 7.5 meter sail to zip around at 19 mph boatspeeds.
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2121
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:27 am    Post subject: probably not Reply with quote

Nope, it's not, but it is the future of light wind foil boarding.

Was kiting the future of light wind windsurfing?

Is kite foiling the future of light wind kite boarding?

-Craig
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NOVAAN



Joined: 28 Sep 1994
Posts: 988

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foiling will not save the sport. Windsurfing is expensive. It is time consuming. It can be hard to learn. You need to be or live at the right place at the right time. If your are a 9 to 5 guy with kids, how do you justify all of the above with the limited free time you have. Foiling boards are $2200. Top of the line foils are as much. Sail, mast, boom, base ,harness wet suit and helmet. Probability pushing $6,000 if your starting from scratch. Foiling might attract older windsurfers that have gear that will work. Its not likely to bring in a lot of new people. I hope I'm wrong cause I need to sell a bunch of old gear...
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 757

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But one would trade big gear for just a foil. Not sail over 5s required...
I am not seeing comments on sensations, jibe, plane, ride, control, skills, etc.

Lake sailor quiver would be:
5.2 + foiling/planing board?
4.0 + planing board only.

One boom, one mast, one extension.

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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 3859
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice that NP is listing a starting level foil for $795, aluminum mast. That, a used Formula board, and some creative glassing should get me up to foil mode.
However, it still depends where you sail. For Berkeley area, it's not viable for me, because I like to sail at spots with winds over 20 mph, and usually get at least 100 days with sails smaller than 6 meters. Don't want to sail over 100 days, as the body get's worn out.
For foiling, sustained deeper water (over 4' depths), is needed, and without too much floating weeds and no underwater obstructions. Probably best in sustained steady winds of 10mph+, up to as much as you need to windsurf in.
So, for me at 160 lbs., the wind range would be 10-14 mph, a very small window of wind in the Berkeley/PtIsabelle corridor.
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 488

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the right sailor in the right environment it absolutely makes sense. Whether that represents a significant proportion of the windsurfing population as a whole I'm not sure.

A two board, 3 sail quiver to cover 8-30mph is a big motivator.
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jingebritsen



Joined: 21 Aug 2002
Posts: 3237

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

again, most people that have light wind gear have sunk big money into it. if one begins to foil, the big stuff either gets sold at a loss, used up or forgotten.

the few that scoff at light wind right now, and are shopping still have to cough up the $2000 for a foil, then a board with a deep tuttle. that plate thing available in the gorge looks sketchy when considering the breakages of deep tuttle race boards in SF Bay.

another issue is water depths. some venues, like canadian hole, it's a non starter.

i've got access to gear, fairly cheap. lots don't. i've got a free race 7.2 sail, all the supporting stuff to get foiling, except it requires more stuff. i have way too much stuff already. not just my ws stuff.....

if you want to go get some, there's plenty on the mkt or in the pipeline

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dllee



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 3859
Location: East Bay

PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Manuel, it's a tough question to answer for almost anyone, without bias associated with actually having to spend the $$$$ money on a foil.
Most people I know who tried foiling have gone onto purchasing a foil, either F-4 or Slab. However, it appears that almost any decent foil get's the job done, as some NP and Starboard foils have shown up and done really well.
Still, for the learning stage at least, it requires a 90+ cm wide board, which usually would plane in windsurfing mode down to 12 mph winds for 160 lbs sailors.
Appealing a lot for bigger sailors, guys who weigh in 220+, it requires a bigger sail and more boatspeed to foil, just like the drawbacks in windsurfing. And of course, in the learning stages, more boatspeed does lead to bigger crash's, which in big sailor's cases, equals more expensive repairs.
So, maybe foiling is a wind/water sport in itself, with some crossover aspects to windsurfing, mostly course racing where we live, but freeriding in Europe and Maui.
Almost every day I go windsurfing, there are 6+ foil rider's who rig in the same area, so I have lots of comparison wind data knowing their sail size choices vs mine.
However, I have no idea how it feels, except explained to me in words, which often doesn't translate very well.
To me, there is nothing like the sensation of going fast in 20+ winds, jumping high and floating, and carving a full planing jibe at full speed.
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