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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
Posts: 6676
Location: on earth

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MalibuGuru wrote:
boggsman1 wrote:
Steve-o...between the corporate tax rate, and the repatriation...US companies will be buying buying stock, and issuing special divs...like there's no tomorrow. I doubt that's what the minions in Peoria envisioned.....


What will the 50% of Americans do who own stock? There'll be a boatload of money in the economy. No doubt that there'll be a lot of inflation.

We'll pay off the debt with cheaper dollars. Win win. I can't find a contractor today, they're so busy. More winning.

I'm long hard assets. Inflation protected assets.


trickle down voodo reagan economics never worked and will not work here. It has one net result, making us a banana republic. Mass movement of money into the top 1 percent.

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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 5702
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MalibuGuru wrote:
boggsman1 wrote:
Steve-o...between the corporate tax rate, and the repatriation...US companies will be buying buying stock, and issuing special divs...like there's no tomorrow. I doubt that's what the minions in Peoria envisioned.....


What will the 50% of Americans do who own stock? There'll be a boatload of money in the economy. No doubt that there'll be a lot of inflation.

We'll pay off the debt with cheaper dollars. Win win. I can't find a contractor today, they're so busy. More winning.

I'm long hard assets. Inflation protected assets.

I'm not dissing the stock market impact on America...Its the mother's milk for the Boggsman, It's how I buy my gear, and beer. But US corporations are the LEAST capital constrained I've ever seen.. They are swimming in liquidity, and access to cheap additional liquidity is plentiful...So, don't tell me an economy running at 3+ % with 4% unemployment(2% if you have 4 year degree) needs a break. I agree we should wack the corporate rate a bit, but the current boondoggle in the Senate only really benefits the stock market, and lower margin dead beat businesses...
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mat-ty wrote:
If the Tax cuts are such a bad idea then let them happen and Trump and the GOP will be toast. Fact is libtards know the economy will take off in a positive direction and they have zero chance of removing Trump if the cuts go through.
It all politics people 24/7..

I agree Matty...I never thought I'd see the day when Republicans all over the land were ok with 1.5TR in new debt, AND tax increases for the bulk of the tax PAYERS in the country..
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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 4186
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The tax plan hasn't even been finalized yet, after it passes the senate it will be blended in some sort of way with the congressional tax plan. The CBO assessment is premature, as well as it's usual practice of assessment taken in a vacuum (no consideration of outside effects on the plan, like growth, and people's reactive behavior). That has always been a problem with the CBO's assessment of anything.
During the Obama administration, the national debt went up $9T, is that better? Also Obama's average GDB growth rate was a measly 1.55%, shall we return to that?
You holding out for perfection? Nobody is going to get perfection.

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vientomas



Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 161

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nw30 wrote:
The tax plan hasn't even been finalized yet, after it passes the senate it will be blended in some sort of way with the congressional tax plan. The CBO assessment is premature, as well as it's usual practice of assessment taken in a vacuum (no consideration of outside effects on the plan, like growth, and people's reactive behavior). That has always been a problem with the CBO's assessment of anything.
During the Obama administration, the national debt went up $9T, is that better? Also Obama's average GDB growth rate was a measly 1.55%, shall we return to that?
You holding out for perfection? Nobody is going to get perfection.


"Depending on who you ask, President Obama added anywhere from $983 billion to $9 trillion to the national debt. Who's lying? None of them. That's because there are three ways to look at the debt added by any president.

The first, and most common, method is to subtract the debt level when he took office from the debt level when he left. The second, and more accurate, method is to add together his projected budget deficits. The third method is the fairest but also the most complicated. It’s to add only the deficits created by the president's specific initiatives.

The largest number comes from calculating how much the debt increased during Obama's two terms. On January 20, 2009, when he was sworn in, the debt was $10.626 trillion. On January 20, 2017, when he left, it was $19.947 trillion. That's why most people say Obama added $9 trillion to the debt, more than any other president.

Before Obama took office, President Bush's last budget (FY 2009) created a deficit of $1.16 trillion. That fiscal year began on October 1, 2008, and continued until September 30, 2009. That means most of that deficit occurred after Obama took office in January. It's not accurate to attribute it to him. When the deficits from all these budgets are added together, President Obama increased the debt by $6.576 trillion.

The fairest method is to measure the debt incurred by Obama's specific policies. The Congressional Budget Office does this for every program. When all these are added up, Obama's debt contribution was $983 billion between 2009 and 2017.

https://www.thebalance.com/national-debt-under-obama-3306293
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boggsman1



Joined: 24 Jun 2002
Posts: 5702
Location: at a computer

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nw30 wrote:
The tax plan hasn't even been finalized yet, after it passes the senate it will be blended in some sort of way with the congressional tax plan. The CBO assessment is premature, as well as it's usual practice of assessment taken in a vacuum (no consideration of outside effects on the plan, like growth, and people's reactive behavior). That has always been a problem with the CBO's assessment of anything.
During the Obama administration, the national debt went up $9T, is that better? Also Obama's average GDB growth rate was a measly 1.55%, shall we return to that?
You holding out for perfection? Nobody is going to get perfection.

If you're arguing that , because the national debt went up a lot after the financial crisis, what's another $1.5TR?...I'd say that's a weak, partisan argument. NW, we are running at 3-3.5% GDP RIGHT NOW!, I say just do the corporate rate...but they can't do that without wacking the hard working upper middle class folks like myself...and of course trash the individual mandate, which puts a world of hurt on the poor folks...
The CBO model does not allow for events that "may" have an impact. Financial analysts model events that are highly likely, like almost 100% probability of happening.
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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

not one right winger who is trying to pass the bill has even read it or any person on his staff read it.

Anyone who votes for it when they or their staff has not read it should be removed from office.

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nw30



Joined: 21 Dec 2008
Posts: 4186
Location: The eye of the universe, Cen. Cal. coast

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

real-human wrote:
not one right winger who is trying to pass the bill has even read it or any person on his staff read it.

Anyone who votes for it when they or their staff has not read it should be removed from office.

But, but, but, "we must pass it to find out what's in it" ~ N.P.

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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
Posts: 6676
Location: on earth

PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nw30 wrote:
real-human wrote:
not one right winger who is trying to pass the bill has even read it or any person on his staff read it.

Anyone who votes for it when they or their staff has not read it should be removed from office.

But, but, but, "we must pass it to find out what's in it" ~ N.P.



https://twitter.com/SenatorDurbin/status/936738041087037440/photo/1



Elizabeth Warren Reads the Republican Tax Bill... Or Tries To.

Quote:
“They want us to vote in an hour. An hour! I spent more than an hour making a decision about the refrigerator we recently bought.”

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mat-ty



Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 2877

PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

boggsman1 wrote:
mat-ty wrote:
If the Tax cuts are such a bad idea then let them happen and Trump and the GOP will be toast. Fact is libtards know the economy will take off in a positive direction and they have zero chance of removing Trump if the cuts go through.
It all politics people 24/7..

I agree Matty...I never thought I'd see the day when Republicans all over the land were ok with 1.5TR in new debt, AND tax increases for the bulk of the tax PAYERS in the country..


Negative, you need better news sources. 70% will see tax decreases, and the economy only needs to grow by .4% to negate the debt increase.
It is amusing listening to the FISCAL HAWKS ON THE LEFT.....NOT!!!!!!!

If this works and the economy continues to grow, Dems are screwed...
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