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Footstrap Positions
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me I'm way more comfortable pushing against a powerful fin at speed from the rail rather than across the top of the board.
I'm pretty far away from you in terms of body composition:
6', 200# and 11.5 feet. On my smaller boards setup with inboard straps it's pretty easy to just stuff my feet in and go, especially when nicely powered. On my formula it's a bit more of a balancing act, takes more commitment and the fin needs to be flying to keep the rail out of the water. Have I gotten my rear foot "swept away" when using poor technique? Yes of course, but it was a learning moment and nothing more.
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tend to think people sail similar gear to those around them not because
they are there , but because it is what works. Where I sail mostly, it is
extremely rare to see boards with outboard strap setups, maybe 5 % of
the riders, and a couple of them are Bruce Peterson, and Dale Cook cruising
through on Formula boards (though these days they tend to cruise through
on Foil boards). Just say'n that what you mostly see is what mostly works
at that location.

-Craig

mamero wrote:

Different venues have different disciplines. People tend to sail similar gear (and perhaps setups) to those around them because its familiar. Just observations and speculation.
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techno900



Joined: 28 Mar 2001
Posts: 2873

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As boards go from wide to narrow (160L Formula to a 75L wave/bump and jump), the straps start on the rails and work toward the center of the board as the boards get smaller. On the small boards, the two front straps literally touch one another, as close to the center as possible. The single rear strap is in the center.

Board width and how the board is used determine strap location. Most contemporary freeride boards are pretty wide, so the straps are more outboard than the older boards of 15+ years ago designed for the same conditions and use.
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 256
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

techno900 wrote:
Most contemporary freeride boards are pretty wide, so the straps are more outboard than the older boards of 15+ years ago designed for the same conditions and use.


Hmm... interesting observation. The trend over the last 5 years is certainly shorter and wider. At least with Starboard anyway. Their Carves and Futuras are definitely wider and shorter than those of just a few years ago.

Now I'm curious. Perhaps over the holidays I should pull out my '04 Carve 121 and my '16 Futura 114 and measure the footstrap positions in relation to the rails, tail, mast track etc. Kind of OCD I know but in the wintertime there's not much real windsurfing going on. Something interesting to do.
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
techno900 wrote:
Most contemporary freeride boards are pretty wide, so the straps are more outboard than the older boards of 15+ years ago designed for the same conditions and use.


Hmm... interesting observation. The trend over the last 5 years is certainly shorter and wider. At least with Starboard anyway. Their Carves and Futuras are definitely wider and shorter than those of just a few years ago.

Now I'm curious. Perhaps over the holidays I should pull out my '04 Carve 121 and my '16 Futura 114 and measure the footstrap positions in relation to the rails, tail, mast track etc. Kind of OCD I know but in the wintertime there's not much real windsurfing going on. Something interesting to do.


Really?! Boundary bay is gonna be rocking all day tomorrow:
https://www.windfinder.com/weatherforecast/boundary_bay_tsawwassen
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 256
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

grantmac017 wrote:
Really?! Boundary bay is gonna be rocking all day tomorrow:
https://www.windfinder.com/weatherforecast/boundary_bay_tsawwassen

This time of year is too cold for my blood. Rigging in 6c (42f) weather in the pouring rain. No thanks. The discomfort outweighs the reward. I'm out till the Spring. Hope you have an awesome session though.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 18358

PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two other major factors in determining board aspect ratio (length to width) are PR and each sailor's objectives. Dealers push what they have to sell, and wide and narrow boards each have their own pros and cons, both individually and collectively.
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grantmac017



Joined: 04 Aug 2016
Posts: 345

PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
grantmac017 wrote:
Really?! Boundary bay is gonna be rocking all day tomorrow:
https://www.windfinder.com/weatherforecast/boundary_bay_tsawwassen

This time of year is too cold for my blood. Rigging in 6c (42f) weather in the pouring rain. No thanks. The discomfort outweighs the reward. I'm out till the Spring. Hope you have an awesome session though.


7/6mm full neoprene jacket Wink

Despite a couple decent swims (post point has a wicked wind line) I was never colder than when I changed. In return I got lit up with a 5.7/106L for several hours with a fun little wind swell to turn on, more than fair trade.
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Goodwind



Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 164
Location: On water

PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mamero wrote:
mamero wrote:
grantmac017 wrote:
Alex you REALLY need to think about heading to Squamish or adjusting to big gear. 10-30 minutes of planing in a day just isn't going to cut it when you restrict yourself to the warm months.

Which iW member is Alex?

Hey Grant. Not sure if you were referring to me or not. I'm not Alex. Anyoo, I did three sessions up at Squamish last summer starting in late July. I tried to alternate weekends between Locarno (English Bay) and Squamish. Squamish is a very different sailing venue than English Bay even when English Bay summer winds pick up. Two of the Squamish sessions were on the Kode 94 (learning the board and practicing waterstarts in the cove). One session on the Carve 121. Generally, Squamish is not a venue I can envision using my Futura 114 very often. MAYBE in the early/mid morning before the regular thermals kick-in. However, when the thermals kick in they usually do so fairly quickly and strongly. I don't think I'd want to be too far out on my Futura 114/7.5 when those thermals do kick in.


English Bay
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pv_xvq7X_dQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40xwKlnpmns
Squamish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a68J6-EjFXA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GaPweOVY7E

Hey mamero, sorry for throwing a curveball at your Futura 114. But if the above clips are indicative of conditions at the two venues near you, instead of wondering about inside or outside footstrap positions, You should seriously consider all out Squamish to dramatically accelerate your progress, albeit you need smaller gears. The 18 to 20 knots (20.7 to 23 mph) wind range and flat water shown in the clips hit the sweet spot of many windsurfers, especially freestylers. I tend to agree with grantmac017 that 10-30 minutes of planing in a day (or actually a week since you only sail once a week) just isn't going to cut it for learning planing jibes. Think of one season at Squamish may equal five or more seasons at English Bay. From the clips, I've noticed that guys in your area love big stuffs, like 7.0 meters for 21-23 mph or 10.5 meters for whatever. But you can have fun with much smaller stuffs doing casual freeride, bum and jump or freestyle. My point is you don't have to be on speed trials or racing mode all the time. At similar conditions, 110lbs to 220lb sailors in my windsurfing neighborhood would be on their 80 to 100 liter boards, 3.5 to 5.7 meter sails. High skilled freestylers tend to use even smaller gears than the rest of us, like 145 lbs guys would use 3.7 or 4.0 meters or 190 lbs guys would use 4.2 or 4.5 meters, etc. With small gears, the ease of handling and feel of control will help you overcome whatever unease that you may have in high wind sailing. For your size, a 90 liter freestyle board, 4.5-4.7 meter sails and 22 to 24 cm fins would be my call.
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mamero



Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Posts: 256
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Goodwind wrote:

English Bay
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pv_xvq7X_dQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=40xwKlnpmns
Squamish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a68J6-EjFXA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2GaPweOVY7E

Hey mamero, sorry for throwing a curveball at your Futura 114. But if the above clips are indicative of conditions at the two venues near you, instead of wondering about inside or outside footstrap positions, You should seriously consider all out Squamish to dramatically accelerate your progress, albeit you need smaller gears. The 18 to 20 knots (20.7 to 23 mph) wind range and flat water shown in the clips hit the sweet spot of many windsurfers, especially freestylers. I tend to agree with grantmac017 that 10-30 minutes of planing in a day (or actually a week since you only sail once a week) just isn't going to cut it for learning planing jibes. Think of one season at Squamish may equal five or more seasons at English Bay. From the clips, I've noticed that guys in your area love big stuffs, like 7.0 meters for 21-23 mph or 10.5 meters for whatever. But you can have fun with much smaller stuffs doing casual freeride, bum and jump or freestyle. My point is you don't have to be on speed trials or racing mode all the time. At similar conditions, 110lbs to 220lb sailors in my windsurfing neighborhood would be on their 80 to 100 liter boards, 3.5 to 5.7 meter sails. High skilled freestylers tend to use even smaller gears than the rest of us, like 145 lbs guys would use 3.7 or 4.0 meters or 190 lbs guys would use 4.2 or 4.5 meters, etc. With small gears, the ease of handling and feel of control will help you overcome whatever unease that you may have in high wind sailing. For your size, a 90 liter freestyle board, 4.5-4.7 meter sails and 22 to 24 cm fins would be my call.


Thanks for the feedback Goodwind. Always appreciated.

Some good videos there. I've watched most of those before.

I would say the Squamish videos represent the venue pretty accurately.

Regarding the Vancouver videos. I know this site pretty well. Judging by the sea-state and conditions overall, both videos represent below average conditions. Certainly not conditions I would normally want to get out of bed for and sail in. If I were to sail in Vancouver on those days I would feel pretty let down. What is hard to see in both those Vancouver videos is there is a very large pier on the windward side of where they are launching from. It generates a huge and very noticeable wind shadow. Generally, where they are launching from is where absolute beginners go to learn. There is a windsurfing school there as well. That's not to say more advanced people can't and don't launch there. However, those of us with more TOW and experience know that launching the other side of the pier is the place to be. There is no wind shadow and much stronger cleaner wind. Regardless of where you launch (leeward or windward side of the pier), sometimes you still need to head out further to get solid consistent wind; sometimes as far as the big ships moored in the background. With that said, both those videos seem to show a pretty dull day in Vancouver overall. There are many days especially early in the season (April, May, early June) where the wind is perfect. And in the summer on sunny days nice thermals can generate pretty stable westerlies. August though is usually the worst month of the year in Vancouver for wind. It gets hot everywhere around Vancouver and there is no movement.

I agree with you on Squamish though. It's the place to really progress quick. In the summer the thermals are almost like clockwork. Last season I made a point to get to Squamish a few times and this coming season I'll be there more often. I have a 94l Kode FSW and some small sails. Gear-wise both my wife and I are set for Squamish (and Vancouver). Now its just TOW and getting comfortable with Squamish sailing. Squamish is overall a different approach than Vancouver. I find Squamish has a bigger intimidation factor but I'll overcome that. Vancouver is very convenient for a quick windsurfing fix though. It's 30 minutes from home one-way. Squamish is more like 1hr 30 minutes one-way on a windy road that's often delayed or closed for hours during the summer. Motorcyclists like to use it as their personal track, wipe-out, and cause accidents and closures. When Jericho/Locarno Beach (English Bay, Vancouver) goes off it can be epic. However, when it's calm like the days shown in those first two videos you sit on a log at the beach and say to yourself "&%$*, should have gone to Squamish!"
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