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Add more fin till it planes?
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rtz



Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 262
Location: Oklahoma City

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:13 am    Post subject: Add more fin till it planes? Reply with quote

I only own 1 board, 3 fins, and 5 sails at the moment. I struggle to plane in any conditions.

Let's say for a given wind, and a given sail; if I keep upsizing the fin; at some point will the fin size selection alone make it plane? I can just run the biggest one I have all the time; but I always wonder if it's not enough fin.

In high winds; what specific reason do you not run a large fin or larger fin then you have to? What would happen if you did?
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U2U2U2



Joined: 06 Jul 2001
Posts: 5444
Location: Shipsterns Bluff, Tasmania. Colorado

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The answer is YOU only have one board. It is huge.
You need a smaller board to compliment the sails .

Size of 125-135 makes title difference here, unless purchasing new then 125Liters.

_________________
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4Boards....May the fours be with you

http://www.k4fins.com/fins.html
http://4boards.co.uk/
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NOVAAN



Joined: 28 Sep 1994
Posts: 1345

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a given board, sail size and tuning are the number 1 factors to get you going. Just adding more and more fin, to a point, can help but not that much.
Running to much fin can make the board less controllable. For speed and control, I always use the smallest fin that won't spin out when heading hard to wind. If others your sailing with are on similar gear and going but your not, its most likely your technique. Look at the ripples or white caps on the water. Point hard into the wind until you see a gust that you think will get you going. Here is the trick. Turn your board down wind and pump the sail and board up and going. Let it run until your up to speed before you start to head up wind. Most newbies don't turn down wind enough because they fear not getting back to the launch area. The best way to get up wind is go down wind and get on a plane. Learn to do this and you will be able to use smaller sails for a given wind speed.
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dvCali



Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 1194

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Add more fin till it planes? Reply with quote

rtz wrote:
I only own 1 board, 3 fins, and 5 sails at the moment. I struggle to plane in any conditions.

Let's say for a given wind, and a given sail; if I keep upsizing the fin; at some point will the fin size selection alone make it plane? I can just run the biggest one I have all the time; but I always wonder if it's not enough fin.


unfortunately not, the fin will not make you plane. You need enough fin to counteract the side force generated by the sail and pumping. Anything more and you will just add drag. Assuming your fin is big enough if you want to plane earlier only solution is a bigger sail (or maybe a bigger board + bigger sail) ...
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2361
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Add more fin till it planes? Reply with quote

I'm going to have to disagree here. If you're on the verge of planning,
but just seem to be in a perpetual state of power slog no matter how much
pumping you do, a bigger fin will get you onto a plane. It'll also buck you
off your board in too much wind. 3 properly spaced fins is probably all
the range you can get out of a single board. After that, too small will just
not get you going and will spin easily, too large will be stiff and bouncy.

-Craig

p.s. I absolutely agree with using the right size fin for the right size sail,
but if you just need 1 more MPH, a bigger fin surface area will do it.

dvCali wrote:
rtz wrote:
I only own 1 board, 3 fins, and 5 sails at the moment. I struggle to plane in any conditions.

Let's say for a given wind, and a given sail; if I keep upsizing the fin; at some point will the fin size selection alone make it plane? I can just run the biggest one I have all the time; but I always wonder if it's not enough fin.


unfortunately not, the fin will not make you plane. You need enough fin to counteract the side force generated by the sail and pumping. Anything more and you will just add drag. Assuming your fin is big enough if you want to plane earlier only solution is a bigger sail (or maybe a bigger board + bigger sail) ...
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rtz



Joined: 31 Oct 2010
Posts: 262
Location: Oklahoma City

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should have mentioned the setup:

240L Viper

4.5m, 4.7m, 5.5, 6.5, 7.5

34cm stock white nylon freebie fin included with board

40cm K4 Fang

48cm Unifiber Freeride

I can run any fin on any sail and really can't quantify a difference. Never had the board spin out or go faster or plane easier.

What match up or pairing would you use; or what size fin for size sail?
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westender



Joined: 02 Aug 2007
Posts: 1246
Location: Portland / Gorge

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure a board that size is going to easily jump on a plane even with the right parts attached. Maybe you're not getting enough sail power sent to your board and fin??
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joethewindsufa



Joined: 10 Oct 2010
Posts: 1114
Location: Montréal

PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fanatic Viper 240 is obviously 240 liters
it is also 91 cm x 290 cm
HUGE as someone mentioned ...
and can take sails up to 10 square meters
comes with a 34 cm fin which i find small for such a wide board
in terms of powerbox I have not used larger than 52 cm

my fastest planing has been on a more narrow board with smaller sail and smaller fin - in more wind obviously
typically flatter water is faster

on my JP SLW92 which is 92 cm wide I use 10 and 8.5 square meter sails and plane in 12-18 knots with 105 kilos / 240 pounds
fins are 66 and 54 respectively - deep tuttle ...
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2361
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your best bet with that board is to pair up the 48CM fin with the 7.5, and take your 180 lb body out in about 16MPH winds. The 4.5 and 4.7 sails
are a poor match for that board in any conditions except for sub-planning basics learning, and the 5.5 and 34cm fin is a desperation stretch to try and make the thing rideable in 25MPH winds.

The best use for that board (other than learning sub-planing basics and some footstrap use in early planing) would be to pair it with an 8.5 and use it for light air planing around 14MPH winds.

That's a big board though and if you're a big guy (say 2 bills plus) you could use it to your advantage in light air down to about 5.5.

-Craig

rtz wrote:
I should have mentioned the setup:

240L Viper

4.5m, 4.7m, 5.5, 6.5, 7.5

34cm stock white nylon freebie fin included with board

40cm K4 Fang

48cm Unifiber Freeride

I can run any fin on any sail and really can't quantify a difference. Never had the board spin out or go faster or plane easier.

What match up or pairing would you use; or what size fin for size sail?
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ctuna



Joined: 27 Jun 1995
Posts: 987
Location: Santa Cruz Ca

PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

List your wind conditions.
It will take some pretty even benign winds
to comfortably plane on a large board.
If you can get somebody to video you and your equipment it
would tell us a lot.
Big fin early planing but decreased ability to turn .
and tail walking bounce out in to much wind.
91cm is super wide unless its one of the newer race salmon boards
which I believe requires a different set of skills.

I would say you need to move down to a under 150 liter board.
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