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board PAINT advice? (after footsrap insert install mod)
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grayson



Joined: 09 May 2003
Posts: 79
Location: Burlington, VT

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dvCali wrote:
Modified Slalom or Formula boards don't really work that well as foil boards Shocked

Can you please elaborate on what specifically "doesn't work well"? Basic board shape and geometry of a Formula board seems like a pretty good fit for foiling once you adjust the footstrap positions a bit. Am I missing something?

I get (more now than when I started this project) that it's a lot of work to move the footstraps. But this board was just collecting dust before, and after foiling it as-is for a season it really felt pretty good, and seemed like all it needed to be "great" was a little tweak to footstrap positions. If I'm missing a critical limitation of Formula board geometry as applied to foiling, I'd love to hear more about what it is specifically.
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dvCali



Joined: 23 Aug 2007
Posts: 969

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

grayson wrote:
dvCali wrote:
Modified Slalom or Formula boards don't really work that well as foil boards Shocked

Can you please elaborate on what specifically "doesn't work well"? Basic board shape and geometry of a Formula board seems like a pretty good fit for foiling once you adjust the footstrap positions a bit. Am I missing something?


I am no an expert by any means, but foil specific boards are very different from a formula or slalom. Visually: shorter, thinner, almost rectangular shape, flat deck, pronounced V with concaves, rails that wrap around significantly. Overall they are much smaller than Formula. Width is anywhere between 68 and 91 that is the PWA limit that is there probably because even pro racers use at most 8.5-9 meter sails. If you have access to a CAD drawing (I did when I ordered my Flikka) you can see how different the boards are. Look in the Shape3d library and you might find some examples.

Based on my experience with a modified slalom board a foil specific board is vastly superior when it comes to control, take off and landing.

Still first generation Berkeley and Crissy sailors were all on Formula, although you do not really see many left on those. Chris, F4 main designer, has been on Starboard for a couple years. He goes out regularly with the 177.



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Last edited by dvCali on Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:37 am; edited 8 times in total
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 18973

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

grayson wrote:
Purchased the pad material from [NSI]

BTW, when I asked about removing the contact-cement residue, I was talking about in the nose area. I'm thinking I may not re-install the enormous nose-pad I had on there for learning to foil, and so want to remove the contact cement residue in the nose area before painting.

Got it. Here's a two-for one suggestion regarding the nose pad: Pad the nose with NSI deck padding material. I've done that for decades on scores of boards. It comes in many colors, looks infinitely better than those nose pillows, that plus clip-on mast pads cut my nose damage rate by 100% (i.e., from many nose repairs every year before to zero in the last 20 years), and it could be cut to cover the pillow adhesive (presuming Goo-Gone won't remove the residue chemically).
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 9381

PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as removing contact cement, I would recommend scraping it off using a single edge razor blade. It might be a little time consuming, but it's effective, and you can finish the job off by sanding with 220 grit wet and dry sandpaper.
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DanWeiss



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Posts: 2272
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:05 pm    Post subject: Re: board PAINT advice? (after footsrap insert install mod) Reply with quote

grayson wrote:
SNIP

- I just want white, don't need precise color match.
- I want it to look decent, but more important is good durability and weather/water resiliency.
- I'm not as weight-conscious as I think Mike is, with his performance race board focus.
- I also have some acrylic dust to re-apply non-skid if needed.
- I plan to put bigger deck pads on with more coverage than the minimalist racing Padz that were on this board before.

So, I turn to youall for guidance...

- Any suggestions for what kind of paint to use?
- Should I skip paint altogether in the areas under my new deck pads, or is that a bad idea?
- Should I sand down to bare fiberglass ('er, carbon fiber) where we'll be re-applying paint?
- Is it worth considering sanding the entire deck down to re-paint the whole thing?
- Also, any advise for removing the contact cement residue where I removed the enormous nose pad? The contact cement residue doesn't seem to respond well to mechanical attempts at removal.

Would sure appreciate any thoughts.

Cheers,
Grayson


Grayson, I write from experience when I worked on my boards.

For white paint, nothing beats epoxy paint for appliances. https://www.rustoleum.com/product-catalog/consumer-brands/specialty/appliance-epoxy-spray/
This paint needs no primer and sticks very, very well to just about anything. The paint is described as water resistant, but I had no issues whatsoever with water being absorbed or wicking underneath.

No need to sand down to the fiberglass etc. Sand the bottom smooth to 400.

Fully-cured contact cement can be removed mechanically, but will clog the sanding media rapidly. Buy lots of sandpaper! I started with 100 grit and continued upward. Remove the cement residue with acetone or mineral spirits. I would be very careful to ensure no cracks exist under the cement because acetone and mineral spirits can seep to the polystyrene core and wreck havoc.

I do advise that you sand off most of the deck grip under the area where the new deck pads will install to ensure maximum adherence regardless of whether you paint the adhesive onto the area or the pads have adhesive already applied.

For grip, mask of the deck area where you do not want grip. Spray a light coat of the paint then immediately dust with the acrylic dust. Let it dry then check for grip level. Repeat once if necessary. Remove masking and spray everywhere you covered but needs paint.

Wet sand and all non-gripped areas to 600. If you want very shiny rails, keep stepping up all the way to 2000, then polish. Keep bottom at 600 and retain cleanliness with an occasional wet sand with 600.

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thombiz



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 713
Location: Corpus Christi

PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First, when painting a board, the paint can easily weigh 1 to 2 pounds for a 120 liter board. keep in mind it will never weigh more than the weight of the wet paint in its container.

You can remove hardened contact cement with Mineral Spirits! I say Mineral Spirits because that is what Gulftech used for years to remove old Boom Grips in preparation for a new grip. They had a tank where they would soak the boom overnight, next morning the grip and glue were easy to get off using rags. For this work on boards, use paper towels, moisten the paper towel with mineral spirits, then put them on the board where the glue exists. spread the moistened paper towel, then cover them with a plastic sheet, like a plastic shopping bag or plastic garbage bag, and tape to the board surface. Let stand for about an hour, pull the plastic and paper towel up and you should be able to use your hand to rub the area with your hand and roll up/remove the old contact cement. Repeat if necessary. Just leave longer if needed for stubborn areas before you try to rub it off. Mineral Spirits is great because it all evaporates leaving no residue behind.

When faced with similar painting issues, as those being discussed, I've used two different paints with great success. The two paints are chosen because they do not seem to yellow as they age and this is important when it comes to white paint. The first paint in IMRON. It is incredible stuff. Great for extreme conditions like fire truck paint, airplanes, etc. It is pricey and it must be sprayed. It covers well without showing substrates below when primer step is skipped. It must be sprayed. Ten year old painted boards still look good.

The second paint is more DIY related. It is Awlgrip polyester based urethane boat paint. Be sure to get the "polyester" based urethane. Again, it does not tend to yellow as it ages. It can be sprayed and it can be rolled on and tipped with a brush. The second method is popular with DIY boat paint projects. If you do the "roll on followed with tipping with a brush " you can Google some hints to help you get professional results. Like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLJOXD9fiBs One tip is use a foam roller you can get at most marine stores who stock West Systems Epoxies. Tipping is done using the tip of the brush with a light touch. Once the paint cures, it is time for wet sanding to get rid of any orange peel texture. This is followed by buffing out with Meguiare's Ultimate Compound available from Autozone or similar car parts stores.

Now, nonskid. I use acrylic dust nonskid "FINE" grade which I get from www.fiberglasshawaii.com in California. I mask off the area to receive nonskid, then lightly dry sand it with 280 or so wet/dry sandpaper to remove the gloss. Then I use a foam roller available from West Systems Epoxies to roll on the urethane paint, the same paint I painted the board with. I roll on 3 light coats of Imron or Awlgrip, and right behind the 3rd coat, I have someone sprinkle on the non-skid by putting the nonskid in a salt shaker. I have the shaker shake the dust from a height of about 18" above the board and shake it on until the gloss is gone from the new Imron or Awlgrip. As soon as the sprinkling is finished, I remove the masking tape and let the nonskid application cure for 3 days minimum.
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