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Harness lines position WAY off from previous setting
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 923

PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 2:37 pm    Post subject: Harness lines position WAY off from previous setting Reply with quote

Hi folks,

I measure my harness lines positions directly from inside of boom clip (where the mast rests against the clip) and in-between the straps.

Being used this system since 2004 so 15 years, woah...
Anyway, I blew the clew on my 5.0 and got my old North Zeta out (4.7).
I measured the position, used my "lift the boom up" to find the center of gravity, both matched. Rigged the same mast and extension as before.

Got to the water and woah... the lines were WAY too far back, I had to choke the sail so hard with my front arm. So I moved them, moved them and moved them forward again to finally reach the sweet spot.

WTH? Any explanation?

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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19113

PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Different sail. It has nothing to do with boom or rig cg, everything to do with the rig's COE under sail.
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 923

PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Settings were for the exact same setup. I even used this sail here and recently too maybe 1.5 yrs ago.
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westender



Joined: 02 Aug 2007
Posts: 1163
Location: Portland / Gorge

PostPosted: Thu May 16, 2019 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably a case of bad wind. I notice it all the time but haven't had to change my lines.
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GURGLETROUSERS



Joined: 30 Dec 2009
Posts: 2306

PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 1:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting Manuel. If you remember I asked about my old 4.2 North Zeta which, in the early 90's I found to be a bit of a no-no rigged on an epoxy Rotho mast on my old waveboard, and definitely so on my old Screamer. The harness lines always seemed to be in the wrong place. I was told at the time (by a well known guru) that I was using a wrong mast, and the sail needed very little outhaul to allow it to pull from well forward. I gave up on it!

A couple of years ago I retried it on a modern RDM mast (it's taller than modern 4.2 sails) and rigged it as suggested and was amazed at the difference it made. In comparison with my more modern Pryde Combat 4.2 it still needed the harness lines further forward, but it felt rock steady, and never overpowered.

I can only assume that being taller and a bit shorter boomed than modern sails it has to pull from well forward. Not much outhaul, and not much shape on the beach, but impressive when powered up!
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 19113

PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

westender wrote:
Probably a case of bad wind.

Yeah, I sometimes get that too, but it's never affected my sailing.
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 923

PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, I remembered it needed lots of downhaul and almost no outhaul (and even then it doesn't touch the boom when powered!).
The sail felt ok, truly alive, maybe a bit too much, very light, un-overpowerable yes.
I was able to try it all with it, even had a rail-grab jump while the lines were still a bit far back, that was a bit scary Very Happy !!!

When I carried it I noticed the lines were too far back too. It's a 4.7 and when with my hand on the boom they were well beyond where I was holding it.

Could my stance and the way I'm driving the power forward have changed that much? I looked at my other settings and they seem to match. My 5.3 is even farther back.
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cgoudie1



Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 2239
Location: Killer Sturgeon Cove

PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Might have affected the sailing of those nearby though.

-Craig

isobars wrote:
westender wrote:
Probably a case of bad wind.

Yeah, I sometimes get that too, but it's never affected my sailing.
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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 923

PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2019 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess one side isn't as bad as the other Very Happy !
Swapping the mast for a newer skinny.
Maybe I never used the sail with so much downhaul before?
Let's see what happens with a different mast.
The one I have now feels a bit stiff up top.

There are many positives though, very reactive, fun, sails amazing in clew first, feels light, good traction, easy tacks, loops nicely, feather on a wave. Super solid and so durable.

EDIT: Just rigged it on a skinny and there's much more loose material around the mast obviously. I'm using a 400 which is IMCS 19 instead of recommended 22. Anyway, it looks really good now and may need some outhaul to dial the pocket. Looking forward to more testing on the water, love it Smile !

A few pics from my first session:








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manuel



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 923

PostPosted: Sat May 18, 2019 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow... what a difference with the skinny mast. Now the sail can breathe filling in with wind and provides a nice reliable pull. It bleeds the wind nicely and is so light in the hands, amazing how it disappears. It has no rear hand, so we can sail relaxed with the pull straight in front of us.

The only big problem is that the foot of the sail is very very low while great to keep the power low it rubs against my shin on shakas and scrapes my skin.

What's more remarkable is that it's 25 years-old and has hardly any crinkle in its fabric. I used it here a lot.

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