Land or Street-sailing?

[gimenezj]

For those who can advise on this winter-alternative of windsurfing which is street sailing or land sailing, I need your thoughts on how to put together the right gear. I thought about getting an off-road skateboard, such as the Mongoose Unicamb or Lightcam (both 117 cm in length with 185 x 50 mm wheels), which would be a more economic alternative to getting the Terrasailor T110 or T-130, which cost much more. Then Id attached a mastbase, etc. My questions for your guys are:

1. Would you agree that the off-road setup might be better to get started…and probably less harsh on the equipment and body parts? (Id like to do it with my boys, and I thought that a soccer field, or a place with short grass, may be a better place before getting more technical on plain pavement…)

2. Has any one tried Mongoose decks? Even though they are less expensive than the Terra or SKB ready-to-go gear, still is more money than using a regular skateboard and just putting bigger wheels.

I see is hard to convince my boys to get in the cold water; therefore, difficult for me to run away the weekends to do the real thing (windsurfing, of course), so I thought that this would be a fun way to play around with them since, as most kids, they love plain skateboarding. Ill appreciate your thoughts.

Juan

[joeyyyy]

I tried one of those rubber wheeled wonders, and thought it sucked.
on my first board, I
used just your standard skateboard.
then wanting to be more comfortable, I built one from plywood.
1/2 x 11 x 42 (rounded ends).
the trucks are 6, and if measured from wheels,
they are 9.5 lip to lip (standard 2 sims pool skate wheels).
I put a strip of 1/2 plywood from truck to truck to ack as spacers, as well as add stiffness to the board.
a little paint and some anti-slip tape, and presto...
A WindSkate is born..
names are many, I allways called it windskating.
to add mastfoot, just drill hole directly behind front truck.
then put the ujoint bolt through it. and off you go....... shredd it up..
joeyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
p.s check this site out if you havent yet been there.
http://www.streetsurfing.de/

[isobars]

Our gang had quite a variety of land sailors, some for grass/dirt, some for pavement. Some had 18 knobby tires for anything from firm sand to natural terrain, hydraulic steering damping, steering trucks like skateboards have, etc. Others were homemade things for pavement, and the remainder fell in between. We had at least half a dozen guys at a time out on any grassy park in sight on breezy afternoons (the water was three hours away, so we werent about to drive three hours for 6.0 sailing).

It was fun for a while .. until our numbers kept dropping off as one after another sailor sprained or broke ankles, wrists, etc. I wore full motocross gear, but thats little protection for ankles or wrists. And a well-known east-coast sailboard shaper was cruising across a parking lot at a walking pace when he went down, fractured his skull, and died.

Hey ... its much safer than the extreme skateboarding on city terrain we see on Real TV, so go for it. Just wear lots of protective gear (that alone is a character builder for young boys), and supervise their land sailing so they (and you) sail safely. This isnt meant as a substitute for BMX or motocross.

And explaing to your boys that the only weather that counts is the weather next to your skin, and neoprene controls that quite effectively.

Mike

************************
I tried one of those rubber wheeled wonders, and thought it sucked.
on my first board, I
used just your standard skateboard.
then wanting to be more comfortable, I built one from plywood.
1/2 x 11 x 42 (rounded ends).
the trucks are 6, and if measured from wheels,
they are 9.5 lip to lip (standard 2 sims pool skate wheels).
I put a strip of 1/2 plywood from truck to truck to ack as spacers, as well as add stiffness to the board.
a little paint and some anti-slip tape, and presto...
A WindSkate is born..
names are many, I allways called it windskating.
to add mastfoot, just drill hole directly behind front truck.
then put the ujoint bolt through it. and off you go....... shredd it up..
joeyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
p.s check this site out if you havent yet been there.
http://www.streetsurfing.de/

[joeyyyy]

Gee mike, what a wet blanket!
I hate to criticize you, Your a really good guy with much to offer to the sport.

I am also Sorry to hear about the shaper.

I dont know about the bad spills, unless its the air-time that shouldnt be had on pavement/dirt/grass/etc.
However, A cheap bike helmet, and maybe knee pads are enough.
But cmon mike, full motocross gear?? dont ya think thats a kinda over-kill? My kids only where a bike helmet, and thats it.
Like when I was a kid, they:
LEARNED HOW TO FALL.
Too many kids today dont learn the basic skill of how to fall correctly. and not get hurt.
dressing up in Full riot gear teaches kids to just fall and hope safty gear protects them.
Keep it real mike!!!!

joeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

[gimenezj]

Thanks a lot guys for elaborating on this...from the great details on how to build your own windskte machine up to the awareness of the safety issues!

The latter, being very important when thinking about our kids, but also almost philosophical on what is nowdays really safe. For example, in addition to windsurfing-- which we started recently-- we are very much into soccer (as expected from our Argentinean background...) and yet my 6-year old just fractured his tibia last weekend in a soccer game. It was a very simple tackle against another kid and, despite wearing a shingard, we heard the crack from far.

I guess my point is that appreciate that youre bringing up the safety concern and also educating on the best way to prevent the most common injuries. (I now wonder if they should get better in the water, learning all the common moves, before trying on land..?!?)

Anyway, thats why I keep liking this forum as a mean to share all this information. Appreciated! Juan

[isobars]

Just wanted to open the guys eyes to the possibilities. From what I see on TV and in the streets, there are some total idiots out there on steel and concrete, and some totally ignorant non-parents letting kids rack themselves up.

But, man, when Im out there weaving among the trees and culverts, fully planing and up on two wheels at 30 mph, darn better believe Im wearing my armor. You get to be a true believer after decades of everything from desert motorcycle racing to riding inverted car hoods down steep hills. Knowing how to fall is ivaaluable, but no substitute for armor when there are hard surfaces involved. Each new piece of armor got added AFTER a hospital visit. I ultimately looked like Michelin Man, but finally them 60-mph git-offs in the dirt got to be FUN! But Ive broken bones just skateboarding ... while lying down.

I agree that helmet, knee and elbow pads, and wrist guards are sufficient for normal landsailing on pavement ... and teach kids that submitting to peer pressure is downright stupid ... but Id still want to limit the chances that my kids are among the scores of thousands that visit ERs every year from skateboards and blades. They dont dress right, they dont play on wheels.

Wet blankets kids live longer.

As far as getting better on water first -- heck, thats the purpose of landsailing, it seems to me. Id just get/build one that works on dirt and grass, protect the most vulnerable body parts, and keep them from racing each other in planing conditions. Theyre going to sprain and/or break ankles just because theyre boys anyway, but rugged high-top shoes and thinking about their ankles when bailing will help mitigate that risk.

Mike

[joeyyyy]

I have to agree with you in some sence, But I ask??
How did you learn the invaluble lesson of how to fall?? And Do you think your kids will learn it with body armor substituting or taking the place of reflex/reaction?

small story:
I did a bunch of pool skating and ramp and half pipe as a kid. I also did motocross and supercross.
At a young age I learned/built a reflex reation uppon a fall.
I dont get hurt often.

Back to the story, (had to give some backround)
at a friends house (about 8 years back) I was so happy to find that they had a half pipe in the back yard.
It was 12 on one side and 10 with side roll in on the other. It had lip rail on the top edge.
It was really cool.
anyway, I played on it and they played and then his youger bro played and eat shit...
Well I saw the instant reaction for him was to land on knees and elbows.
The same held true for his friends too (a small age gap).
To say the least, I saw the younger generation using pads and helmets and didnt use any Technique.
Where as us older guys rolled to avoid injury, They relyed on safty gear.

I think there is something in the mentality of safty gear that needs thinking about.
Im not saying not to use, but not to over do it, or think that safty gear takes the place of good reflex/reaction.
just my two cents..
joeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

[isobars]

I agree that reliance on gear INSTEAD of technique is short-sighted. But:
1. Some people are never going to develop the protective tumbling abilty you and I have.
2. Tumbling ability depends on a solid launch platform. Once we have been launched, our trajectory and angular momentum are defined by physics, limiting our choices on just how and where were going to land.
3. The price of mistakes, ineptitude, or kids perception of invincibility when surrounded by concrete is too high to blow off protective gear.
4. Im sure many of the scores of thousands of busted-up kids that hit the ERs every year are great tumblers ... who exceeded their limits. Many of them will pay a price forever because they were too insecure to tell their buds where to shove their taunts.

Some ... well, one; the rest of them have a brain worth protecting ... of my buds gets on my case every time I put on a helmet to windsurf (which is every time). I ignore him because my ego is healthy enough to allow me to ignore HIS ego problem.

Mike

[joeyyyy]

I disagree with the
depends on a solid launch platform thinking way.
I beleave that its all reflex to the fall (what ever the situation).
As to the scores of er kids, Well they may have exceeded their abilities, or just didnt have any experence Protecting them selfs from injury without the protective gear.
But Mike?? a helmet??
Well you do have those pesky barges over there.
anyway, a helmet in the water isnt such a bad Idea being that you can Passout amd die (drown) in the water, yet when if on land you would only be out cold to wake up with a head ache.

Well the debate was fun.
in conclution,
any reasonal amount of safty prevention is better than none at all.
hence the term:
an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of @#$%@#% (misery)...

Happy shredding.
joeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

[isobars]

1. Your beliefs dont change physics. We cannot alter our trajectories until we reach sky-diver speeds.

2. Try telling any health care worker, any highway patrolman, any of the hundreds of thusands of people with permanent brain damage, or any of their parents that we just wake up with a headache after head injuries.
3 Come back and say THAT again when you have kids. Bare heads and cement seldom mix temporarily.

Mike