High wind board

[prospect]

Hi Im looking for a board for 5.5 wind and smaller.I weigh 210 sail in b&j conditions .My quiver of boards are: naish titan 135ltr & fanatic cross 100ltr.
so Im looking for the one board does it all.... High wind boardFor those blustery and nuken days. Thanks Hollis

[carl]

Im not sure what youre asking, you can ride any small board you want. At this point its just a matter of personal preference.Im 200lbs and have trouble slogging anything under about 85-90L, but thats about the only limiting factor (wider boards are easier to slog). You can ride a 60L if your always planing. I like the small JP freestyle waves, they plane early and you can put in a big powerbox fin. If your buying new, you should demo first.

[saltweb]

Hey Hollis,

Ive been thinking about getting that 268 Titan for some time now. What do you think of it? What sizes of sails do you use on it? Is it a flat rocker board, or is it still good out in the ocean?

Im 250 lbs, so I can relate to being on that end of the sailor spectrum. Its very difficult to pick boards as a big guy because they are all shaped relative to average riders, weighing far less. For instance, most sailors have an all around board that JUST floats them, that will float home when the wind dies, but will still hang in there in higher winds. For anyone up to about 200 pounds, thats a board approximately like a 105 liter Flow. But I need a 130 liter Flow. All the 130 liter boards are unfortunately shaped for flat water. The closest boards I can think of, that I can blaze around with on a 7.5 - and still take out in the ocean on a 5.8, would be something like the 268 Titan, the new 140L HiFly Free board, or the new Screamer 133. They are all about 67-70 wide and 133-140 liters, but even these more performance oriented boards are set up for flat water, really.

The same applies to a smaller board. I can probably take a 100 liter board into as high winds as many people sail on their 85 liter board. It happens to me all the time, Im on my Naish Titan (110 L) and a 5.2 or 5.8, and others are out on 85-95 liter boards and 4.6-5.4 sails. That small Titan hangs in there for me in almost anything. Sure, when its solid 4.5-5.0 weather (which is 4.0-4.5 for most people), the speedy Titan gets a little bouncy.

The other thing that comes into play is where you are sailing. For instance, here in New England, a 5.0 day really means 20 to 40 knots with higher gusts. How do you rig for that? Theres no good sail size for such wildly gusty/up and down conditions. For that reason, the Titan works for me because it can still hang in there in the lulls, but it works well maxed out. In gusty conditions, I like to go out a little big.

Anyway, back to your original question, what size for a smaller board. That Cross 100 should work for you like my small Titan and hang tough into surprisingly windy conditions, depending on the water state. But stepping down from that board, at your size, I wouldnt go too much smaller. I once had a Naish Wave board (85 and about 87 liters) and I never sailed it. If I lived on Maui where 25 knots was really 24-26 with gusts to 26.5, well then that board would have worked for me. Instead, I traded it for an 86 Naish wave board that is 92 liters. Its a total sinker for me and I only get it out on nuclear days. I can sail it when its blowing 35+ out, as long as my sail is rigged right and I have an appropriate fin.

That begs the question, what kind of fins are you using on the Cross 100? Have you tried a smaller or more swept back wave fin? Check out the True Ames website and look at the Onshore wave fin, as well as the Fox Surf fin and the Convert. If your fin is too big for your small sail, then your board will seem way too big.

So, another sailor I know (180 lbs) has a 90 liter 82 Mistral Shift as a high wind board. He said its a little on the slow side, but its great for bump and jump and wavesailing. No surprise, its got alot of rocker just like my wave board, and its bound to sail like a wave board - great in the waves but slow to plane and not as speedy as a freeride board. But who cares about speed when youve got more wind than you can handle. Then its more of a matter of sticking to the water. If you really want to gain control, then get a True Ames slotted Enduro fin. Slotted fins are really slow and manageable, perfect for crazy conditions.

Back to boards for you. Just dont go too small, thats all Im saying. Anyone giving you advise that is 60 pounds lighter than you probably doesnt understand your world. And in checking out magazine board reviews, beware of the fact that most of the testers are also smaller than you. I think you should check out something in the 90-100 liter range. You could even get a board that is the same size as your Cross 100, just shaped differently.

Ive been also thinking of boosting up the size of my small board one step further, swapping my 92 liter Naish wave board for the larger 100 liter Naish Quest. The Quest is a wave board that is tuned as a more all around board. While the size of the board doesnt appear to be a big step down in size from the small Titan, I think that it will actually operate in much windier conditions.

One sailor I know, that is hugely into wave sailing, used to own two different boards of almost the exact same size: (1) one of the earlier Mistral/Naish Freeride boards (the 87) and (2) a Naish wave board. While they were the same volume, their shapes had entirely different applications.

Hope this helps,

Peter.

[prospect]

Hey Peter:
Thanks for the responce.First of all Im just getting comfortable in the back strap and maybe not Qualafied to answer some of your Questions. That being said I find the Tiaian hard to get used to(ive also had some of my best days on it)Ive used it with a 5.8, 7.0 and a 8.5 and the 7.0 seems to be the sweet spot. It likes to be overpowered and so do I but it seems to be a little stiff, and I get calf cramps trying to keep up wind, however I try for the bigger fin to accomidate the sail and maybe theres a thin line between leg cramps and spinning out(another propblem with me)Rocker? I dont know from rocker,but this board loves wind.
I have a 48cm blue motion (g10) fin I use with the 8.5 and sometimes the 7.0 otherwise I use a 12 to 14 swept back kind of slalom fin( for the cross I also have a 9.5 rhino wave fin)Ive never tried a slotted fin,and would like to try one.
The Naish company has all my respect as they are both accomidating and
concaened with the costemers happiness, how -ever I might trade the 268 for a larger cross.
wich leads to the hquestion(somehow) of a high wind board has any one tried a gorge animal? I would be intrested to hear some testamonies and/or horror stories
thanks. Hollis

[carl]

Hollis and Peter,
The Gorge Animal can handle anything the gorge can dish out (which is alot). BUT I think youre not ready yet for a stone sinker if youre only starting to get comfortable with the straps. The problem is slogging it. Until you learn to sail overpowered, youre going to be very frusterated with any board less than 90 liters.
Peter, I have a Titan 268 and like it alot but its really only good for light wind if there is any chop over about 1ft. It is VERY fast and wants to jump but with the wide tail it feels too big in the air. You may be able to control it though since youre 50lbs more. It goes upwind very well with a 44cm fin (the stock fin spins too easy). Its a great alternative to the formula though, it plans up very quick and turns quick, but definatly feels like a big slalom board once moving fast.

[carl]

Peter,
I forgot to mention that I found a great big guy board for chop, F2 Wizzard. It is so smooth in SF bay chop (usually 2-4ft) that it continues to amaze me, and it feels good jumping (im an old wimpy jumper though). I have the 115L, you may want the 125L. It takes a little more power to plane up but it has so much range on the top end that I sold my 100L board and go straight to a 91L when it starts blasting.

[schnapps]

Hi Pete, very interesting topic, for me I`v been finding that my medimum wind board (104lts, Maxride 64.5 AHD)is not as comfortable as I would like it to be, I find it to be a hard ride in conditions of 25mph +/-, if thats the right discription.

As you were talking about the Rocker of boards, it got me thinking that my board may be too flat, so I checked the spec`s and came up with this,

Scoop/Rocker 258/6 on a board that is 250cm long, I`m not sure what this means, so I woundering if you could explain, to be honest a lot of the lingo used in board manufacturing confuses me, but that`s for another day,
schnapps.

[wdsurf]

try a realwind 270 or 261 fast loose and in full control all the time i ride a 251 iam 180 lbs. and use 5.5 and down.joe

[saltweb]

Hi Carl,

You must love life sailing out in the Bay area, where you have somewhat more predictable wind than here in the stormy northeast.

Isnt it funny how different people find different boards? What might be a great light wind ocean board for me could be interpretted as a pig (too much rocker and V) by the average Joe (who would use that size board on light days).

Ive heard some people get down on the Wizzard, but they were much smaller than me, and Ive often found that boards that many dont like are perfect for me. Ive got to try one sometime.

Thanks for the feedback on the medium Titan. It seems more geared to flat water or lighter conditions than even the smaller (110 L) Titan. Im forever pushing the limits of boards, as I generally use them slightly out of their intended range. Id like to see how well I could hold down the 268 Titan in higher winds, ocean swell, and overpowered. But I hear you, it sounds geared more for flat water. I didnt know they made a 125 liter Wizzard. I wonder if its toned towards flat water, like everything else. The old 284 Flow was tempting, as at first glance it looks like a big Swiss Army knife board, but really, its geared towards the flats.

Somebody I know has the biggest tri-fin Real Wind board. Hes the same size as me and he loves it. I tried it on the Cape and really liked it too. It rides like on rails, and really sticks to the water in bad weather.

Catch you later,

Peter.

[saltweb]

Hey Dude,

How about all this wind lately? Im wishing I didnt have so much work right now, although now Saturday is looking better than Friday for the northeast.

Yes, interesting topic. The more I sail, the more Im interested in how the boards finer shape characteristics affect performance. Like, when purchasing a board, many sailors only look as far as volume, width, recommended sail size, and board classification (wave, freeride, etc.)...but there are so many other critical factors. I just picked up a copy of the UK magazine, BOARDS, that I found in Fowles, in Newburyport. Its far superior to our US Windsurfing magazine in size and content. You can tell the readership is much larger. Why Fowles had a few copies Ill never know. They dont even carry Windsport. Perhaps they thought it was a surf mag when they ordered it, or maybe a woodworking periodical. Anyway, there was this interesting article in there about the confusion over all the free-*** boards out there: freeride, freemove, freestyle, freecarve, freewave, freeformula, etc. Its very confusing for the shoppers, and there just arent enough readily available board specifics to judge the difference.

Anyway, the writer went on to break up the boards by rocker characteristics alone, as follows: high/low nose rocker, high/low tail rocker. The high tail AND nose rocker boards were slower but great for the waves. The high nose rocker and low tail rocker boards were fast and good in the ocean, planed early, and jumped well, but could become too bouncy in heavy chop, and werent necessarily suited to the waves. Then there were the low tail and nose rocker boards. Actually, some intense freestyle boards fit in this catagory (Naish Flying Pig, for example) - made to plane up early and JUMP. The article made me miss all the spec details Windsurfing used to provide, back when I didnt understand too well what all those numbers meant.

The Maxride is definitely a good board, but it is what it is, as they say. You were saying the rocker was 6 (cm) - but is that the nose or tail rocker? It sounds like a fairly low rocker board. Besides the amount of rocker, the actual rocker profile is often complex and can dramatically affect the ride of the board. Put it down on a rug and push down on the very back of the tail. Thats the easiest way to feel the tail rocker, which is often very subtle. You can feel how much tail flat there is, and often you can even feel the V shape to the board (ridge running down the centerline bottom). If the Maxride has alot of tail flat, that would explain why it gets bouncy. But also, perhaps the size (volume and width) relative to your size just means you get overboarded earlier than you might on something else.

How wide is it at one foot from the tail? My 110 L Titan is very fat in the tail, and so Id bet many would find it seemed too big too early.

The other thing is that at 25 knots, Im not surprised youre ready to swap down to a smaller board, if youre anything but my size. Thats alot of wind if its not a New England 25 knots (i.e., many gusts but also deep lulls).

Theres just no perfect board anywhere, really, they are all compromises in some way. But then, putting them through their paces and then trading for something different, isnt that part of the fun of it all?

Take it easy,

Peter