Electrical Vehicles

coboardhead · Joined: 26 Oct 2009 Posts: 4303

Mac

You threw a bunch of numbers out there that don’t mean anything unless you can also illustrate how the demand on those raw materials will increase if we go to a totally EV world. If we convert 1.4 billion autos to 300 mile range Tesla’s, do we have enough raw material? Citing reserves available, based on current use is meaningless.

Regarding the production of lithium in both Chile and Australia. Both regions are dry and lithium production takes a LOT of water. Isn’t that an issue? Or,
should I just take your word for it that it isn’t an issue because oil is bad?

I just want the data that shows we have the minerals to go electric and I want to know the environmental and social costs for going there. That’s all.

mrgybe · Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 5181

mac · Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:27 am Post subject:

techno900 · Joined: 28 Mar 2001 Posts: 4166

Stats from the EPA:

For the US - 28% of Green House Gas is from transportation.
For the US - 59% of the above is from cars.
For the US - 16.5% Total GHG in the US from cars.

US produces 15% of the worlds GHG

US cars produce 2.4% of the worlds GHG.

So, how much will global warming be impacted if the US quickly moves to all electric cars, not forgetting that only 23% of the energy for charging the cars is from green sources, or 77% from polluting sources.

I am not opposed to EVs, but moving too fast accomplishes almost nothing. Currently, I have no interest in an EV, but as technology and batteries improve, maybe one day? However, I will probably die before it makes sense to buy an EV.

mrgybe · Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 5181

Predictably, Berkeley dismisses any analysis that doesn't coincide with his biases. I repeat, the analysis I quoted was from the comments section of the WSJ. If he believes the statistics are inaccurate, let him rebut them with facts, not name calling. Perhaps he doesn't believe this either.......

More than half of the world’s lithium resources lies beneath the salt flats in the Andean regions of Argentina, Bolivia and Chile, where indigenous quinoa farmers and llama herders must now compete with miners for water in one of the world’s driest regions. Lithium mining requires huge amounts of groundwater to pump out brines from drilled wells, and some estimates show that almost 2 million litres of water are needed to produce one ton of lithium.
In Chile’s Salar de Atacama, lithium and other mining activities consumed 65% of the water, causing groundwater depletion, soil contamination and other forms of environmental degradation, forcing local communities to abandon ancestral settlements.

Or this.....

Nearly 50% of world cobalt reserves are in the Democratic Republic of the Congo, which accounts for over two-thirds of global production of the mineral. About 20% of cobalt sourced from the central African nation comes from artisanal mines, where some 40,000 children work in extremely dangerous conditions, according to UNICEF, the UN’s children's agency.
The dust from excavation may contain toxic metals including uranium that are linked to health problems such as respiration diseases and birth defects.
The environmental risks are just as worrying. Cobalt mine sites may contain sulphur minerals that can generate sulfuric acid when exposed to air and water. This process, known as acid mine drainage, can devastate rivers, streams and aquatic life for hundreds of years.

https://unctad.org/news/developing-countries-pay-environmental-cost-electric-car-batteries

J64TWB · Joined: 24 Dec 2013 Posts: 1685

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/child-miners-electric-cars-work/

techno900 · Joined: 28 Mar 2001 Posts: 4166

mac · Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 1:14 pm Post subject:

boggsman1 · Joined: 24 Jun 2002 Posts: 9122 Location: at a computer

swchandler · Joined: 08 Nov 1993 Posts: 10588

techno900,

So, do you believe that increased battery manufacture will never lead to any improvements in cobalt mining, battery manufacture, or any decrease in the negative affects and dangers to humans involved in its extraction of minerals and their refining?

Maybe for someone like you that is politically against creating sensible rules and regulations in business and industry that might affect its corporate profit potential, you've just accepted a position that nothing should change, and that no important improvements of any kind are ever possible over time.

Sometimes it hard for me to believe that you were actually involved in the education of young folks. Where's your vision?