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Lake Perris closed by rangers at 30mph
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MalibuGuru



Joined: 11 Nov 1993
Posts: 8914

PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

swchandler wrote:
On Santa Ana winds you might want to consider Port Hueneme. If the surf is not too big, it can be a very fun time.

Needless to say strong offshore conditions in the ocean can be risky if you breakdown, so you want to be sure your gear is in good shape. Also, it helps to sail with others at this location. Lastly, you must pay to park, and the police monitor frequently to ensure compliance.


Used to go to Hueneme at 6 a.m. with 60 mph winds....what was I thinking 🤔 🤣
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NOVAAN



Joined: 28 Sep 1994
Posts: 1489

PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2021 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We had this issue years ago at lake Perris. The main concern for the rangers was windsurfers in trouble and getting pushed against the dam. After much negotiation, it was decided we could windsurf in winds up to 50mph but had to do it at the east end of the lake at lot #12. Also years ago, I was out at the east end lot 12 and a ranger told me I could not windsurf there. I ask her to check with the head ranger and informed her of our agreement. Someone in the lake office found a copy of the agreement and I was allowed to go windsurfing. Maybe you guys as a group could get together and revisit that agreement. Lot 12 has better wind coming out of the E/NE. It funnels between the island and the shore and is a bit stronger there. The water is smoother and you don't get the wind shadow down wind from the island. Also you rig on grass out of the wind...
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loopless



Joined: 30 Jun 1997
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All, here are the revised regulations
- Kiting is banned on Lake Perris
- "The lake surface will be closed to all vessels or similar objects when a wind speed of 39 miles per hour or greater is reached"
So better than 30 , at least!


These are all posted on the
https://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=28984
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10427

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2022 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How does a windsurfer avoid the 25 mph limit identified in number 1?


1. No personal watercraft, powerboat, kayak, or float tube with less
than 6 inches of freeboard, measured from the water surface to the
lowest portion of the gunwale, shall operate, anchor, launch or
remain on the lake’s surface when wind speed reaches or exceeds
25 miles per hour (Inland Lake Wind Advisory).

2. The lake surface will be closed to all vessels or similar objects
when a wind speed of 39 miles per hour or greater is reached
(Gale).
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loopless



Joined: 30 Jun 1997
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2022 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"We" are not personal watercraft ( a personal watercraft is defined as a jet ski) so are not subject to that 25mph limit.

It was a great day up there today, warm and 5.5-6.0 fully wound-up conditions for windsurfing and of course a lot of dingers having a great time. Tomorrow and Tuesday look like a repeat.

The rangers kicked out a few kiters who had obviously not got the memo.

Seriously I feel sorry for the rangers having to enforce that complex web of regulations! But I think the 39mph limit is a reasonable compromise.
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Riptide



Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 402

PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

loopless wrote:
"We" are not personal watercraft ( a personal watercraft is defined as a jet ski) so are not subject to that 25mph limit.

It was a great day up there today, warm and 5.5-6.0 fully wound-up conditions for windsurfing and of course a lot of dingers having a great time. Tomorrow and Tuesday look like a repeat.

The rangers kicked out a few kiters who had obviously not got the memo.

Seriously I feel sorry for the rangers having to enforce that complex web of regulations! But I think the 39mph limit is a reasonable compromise.


The reason or excuse for no kiteboarding is stated as contrary to direction of flow of water craft, there is a counter clockwise regulated movement of water craft around the island.
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Riptide



Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 402

PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

loopless wrote:
"We" are not personal watercraft ( a personal watercraft is defined as a jet ski) so are not subject to that 25mph limit.

It was a great day up there today, warm and 5.5-6.0 fully wound-up conditions for windsurfing and of course a lot of dingers having a great time. Tomorrow and Tuesday look like a repeat.

The rangers kicked out a few kiters who had obviously not got the memo.

Seriously I feel sorry for the rangers having to enforce that complex web of regulations! But I think the 39mph limit is a reasonable compromise.


The reason or excuse for no kiteboarding is stated as contrary to direction of flow of water craft, there is a counter clockwise regulated movement of water craft around the island. https://www.parks.ca.gov/pages/651/files/LakePerrisCampgroundMapFINAL092816.pdf 2nd column, first paragraph.
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loopless



Joined: 30 Jun 1997
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When windsurfing, kiting, or winging we all just "go with the wind" without regard to any "circulation" around the island. Generally that means hot laps back and forth.

One of those PDF's just bluntly says "no kite-boarding allowed"
https://www.parks.ca.gov/pages/651/files/ADA%20LPSRA%20952-21-007%20prohibited%20aquatic%20activities.doc.pdf

I am not sure of the reasoning. Could be perceived safety for other lake users or because too many rescues of kites blown onto the dam.
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isobars



Joined: 12 Dec 1999
Posts: 20816

PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just looked at a map of Perris. My immediate reaction was, "You've got to be kidding me!"

It's a pond ... a beautiful but still quite small lake. Short of a heart attack, what's to stop a WSer from just swimming his board to any leeward shore and walking/hitchhiking back to his van? Why does the damned GOVERNMENT -- or any lake user -- think it's the GOVERNMENT'S job to rescue an overpowered boater? Wildfire fighters know their limits and cease rescue operations when conditions get too hairy; why can't Parks & Rec do the same? Just because their boats are sized for a lake rather than San Francisco Bay shouldn't prohibit us from playing out there.

In the Gorge and virtually everywhere else I've sailed across much of the U.S., the rangers/coasties/sheriffs/cavalry realized decades ago that the death rate among WSers, even in full gales in MUCH larger bodies of water, is practically, statistically zero. Our main lake in NM covered maybe 100 square miles at 40 miles long when I lived there, and the Corps and Coast Guard rescue teams simply kept an eye on us for our safety even when the winds were averaging 40, 50, 60 or more mph (once gusting to 96 mph)... and that was way back in the last century on lesser gear. The Corps rangers at our Chinook-powered NM lake would take their chairs out on their elevated lawn and laugh at our asses-over-teakettle antics in winds averaging >50 mph with frequent gusts >60.

IT'S ONLY WATER, and most lake shorelines are accessible on foot and by vehicle, so what's the problem with these damned nanny states, counties, cities, or individual lakes? WTH should chicken-livered, land-locked, karaoke-loving bureaucrats be deciding what wind speeds we can handle, let alone enjoy? Why can we drive at 70 mph, smoke tobacco, eat junk food, take statins or aspirin, drink alcohol, SKYDIVE, yet be kicked off a beautiful lake on a nice windy day?

That's not a rhetorical question. It has some answers/solutions, such as:
• Start a letter-writing campaign. My letter to the County or State Parks & Rec director got good results discussed in CA news media ... and I didn't even live in CA. I've had equal or better outcomes EVERY TIME (well over a dozen) I've appealed for sanity to other state and federal agencies, even in the military, regarding other onerous constraints.
• Appeal to a court to intervene. Been there, done that, won handily, on two unnecessary restrictions.
• Failing that, take 'em to court. Literally sue the bastards. There are hundreds or thousands of hours of video evidence online of thousands of average Joes having an absolute and safe freaking BALL in winds gusting over 40 or 50 mph.
• Examine the "law", as one fellow did above. Do the bureaucrats even have the authority to enforce lake closures just because whitecaps scare them? Do such closures even apply to ALL water users? Previous comments (and government mask edicts) suggest the answers are "No" and "No".

In most places I've sailed in the contiguous 48 states, if there's enough wind to plane on a 6.0, the gusts top 30. OOPS! SORRY, DUDES AND DUDETTES; A GUST HIT 31 MILES PER HOUR! YOU'RE ALL GONNA DIE! YOU GOTTA PACK UP YER 5.0s AND GO HOME.

OK, OK ... so you got a waiver until a gust hits 39 mph ... this time ... pretty danged common when a 4.5 is powered up. How many Perris WSers have been killed by excessive wind in 4.2 conditions?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWRjN2WemlA
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jse



Joined: 17 Apr 1995
Posts: 1425
Location: Maui

PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

isobars wrote:
I just looked at a map of Perris. My immediate reaction was, "You've got to be kidding me!" (snip)


Welcome to California where windsurfing is a concept virtually no one but the practitioners gives a rats ass about. Berkeley soon to be walled off by the ferry terminal, Treasure Island imposing access fees making a trip to arguably the best site in the bay cost $15 to $20 if I did my math right. Candlestick closed to vehicles. It would frustrate me to no end to deal with sketchy launches, broken glass, used condoms and needles to get to the water, while in the Gorge the freakin' freeways have exit signs with images of windsurfers to direct you to the launch.

Steve
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