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swchandler
Joined: 08 Nov 1993 Posts: 10588
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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techno900, are you the lone Republican in this nation that doesn't support states rights? It's hard to believe that you're so wound up about California's business from 2500 miles away. Why not be thankful for what you've got in North Carolina and just chill. |
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vientomas
Joined: 25 Apr 2000 Posts: 2343
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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Do some research Teach. A red flag law requires a judicial determination that a person should not possess a weapon and permits siezure of the same under certain due process requirements. Namely, notice and an opportunity to be heard in a court of law. It is about gun possession only. That's somewhat different from the legislation we have been discussing which pertains to educators making reports to law enforcement for behaviors incuding, but not limited to many behaviors other than those which would trigger a red flag law. As you appear to have a difficult time grasping the difference, I shall refain from further comment as it is a waste of my time. Have fun with your box of crayons, you seem to have a penchant for coloring things. |
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mac
Joined: 07 Mar 1999 Posts: 17747 Location: Berkeley, California
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Posted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 12:56 pm Post subject: |
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When you get your daily dose of adrenaline and outrage by reading Breitbart, and you don't bother to think, you are sentenced to live in North Carolina next to a pig shit lagoon. |
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techno900
Joined: 28 Mar 2001 Posts: 4161
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Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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vientomas wrote: | Do some research Teach. A red flag law requires a judicial determination that a person should not possess a weapon and permits siezure of the same under certain due process requirements. Namely, notice and an opportunity to be heard in a court of law. It is about gun possession only. That's somewhat different from the legislation we have been discussing which pertains to educators making reports to law enforcement for behaviors incuding, but not limited to many behaviors other than those which would trigger a red flag law. As you appear to have a difficult time grasping the difference, I shall refain from further comment as it is a waste of my time. Have fun with your box of crayons, you seem to have a penchant for coloring things. |
Partially correct, but there is more to it, but it doesn't impact schools because the age to buy a long gun in Calif. is 21.
Quote: | The new laws, therefore, reflect an expansion of existing law. The laws are enumerated in Assembly Bill 61. California Governor Gavin Newsom recently signed this legislation into law. It went into effect on January 1, 2020.
Note that if a judge grants a restraining order, he/she can prohibit a person from the following:
having a gun in his custody or control,
owning a gun,
purchasing a gun,
possessing a gun, or
receiving a firearm or ammunition.1 |
However, I (we) have been sidetracked, and none of you have addressed the reason for the change in the law. Reasonable justification or not? It looks like the schools will be able to use ethnicity and skin color in deciding to call the police or not. Racist? - big time. Nutty? - you bet!
Quote: | The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) has praised the Bradford bill as promoting racial “equity”: “Once students make contact with law enforcement, they are less likely to graduate high school and more likely to wind up in jail or prison. These harms fall disproportionately on students from marginalized groups: Black, Indigenous, and Latinx students, as well as students with disabilities, are disproportionately referred to law enforcement, cited, and arrested” (original emphasis).
Proponents claim the bill will “protect students from unnecessary interactions with law enforcement.”
Sen. Bradford told the Daily Caller: “Our existing system has led to alarming disparities in the type of students who are most likely to suffer these harms. Black students, Latinx students, students of color, and students with disabilities are disproportionately referred to law enforcement, cited, and arrested.” |
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coachg
Joined: 10 Sep 2000 Posts: 3550
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Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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techno900 wrote: | However, I (we) been sidetracked |
Easily done when you are a few bricks short of a full load.
We have tried multiple ways to explain the reasonable justification for the law but it just flys over your head. It probably explains why you can’t comprehend why CA has longer life expectancy, higher college graduation rates, lower murder rates, lower suicide rates,… than NC.
Keep digging TechNo, but we are still better off than you
Coachg |
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swchandler
Joined: 08 Nov 1993 Posts: 10588
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Posted: Tue Jun 07, 2022 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think that techno900 understands the value of providing some reasonable discretion to authorities in applying our laws and issuing penalites, particularly when minors are involved.
As we've found out over the years with more draconian 3 strikes provisions, when sentencing repeat offenders running awry of the law, the extent of applying suitable punishment isn't necessarily that cut and dried, or always in the best interest of all parties concerned. Often it can make sense to have some discretion in judging and defining punishment.
It has to be remembered that the US incarcates more folks than any other nation. That isn't something that we should be proud about, but I think that must be lost on so many "law and order" Republicans. Sadly, we spend more on prisons and mass incarcation than we spend on education. |
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techno900
Joined: 28 Mar 2001 Posts: 4161
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Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 8:02 am Post subject: |
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swchandler said: Quote: | Often it can make sense to have some discretion in judging and defining punishment. |
Let's say, four 18 year old kids in one high school, all get caught selling drugs. All independent of one another. One is white, one is black, one is Hispanic and one is Asian.
And you think the school should have discretion as to who gets turned into the police and who does not? Liberal justice explained.
Coachg - No comment on the new law? Just diversion and insults which is not surprising. |
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coboardhead
Joined: 26 Oct 2009 Posts: 4303
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Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 9:18 am Post subject: |
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Techno
Have you read the proposed law? Do you have any experience interpreting laws and codes? I'm a "code jockey". I read and apply codes for a living (building codes in my case). It is always amazing to me how folks can read what they want in a code or regulation when they have little training and don't understand the intent. |
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techno900
Joined: 28 Mar 2001 Posts: 4161
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Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 11:07 am Post subject: |
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coboardhead wrote: | Techno
Have you read the proposed law? Do you have any experience interpreting laws and codes? I'm a "code jockey". I read and apply codes for a living (building codes in my case). It is always amazing to me how folks can read what they want in a code or regulation when they have little training and don't understand the intent. |
Yes, have you read it? The only thing that remains in the law is:
The law now says: Quote: | The principal of a school or the principal’s designee shall notify the appropriate law enforcement authorities of the county or city in which the school is located of any acts of a pupil that may involve a violation of Section 626.9 or 626.10 of the Penal Code |
Quote: | Penal Code 626.9 and 626.10 make it a crime to bring guns or other weapons onto school grounds, such as: Kindergarten through K-12 schools; any private university; the University of California; the California State University; or the California Community Colleges. Any gun is prohibited on school grounds. |
It appears that all other crimes are optional to report. That's where the big change has occurred. Caught selling drugs? Optional reporting. |
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swchandler
Joined: 08 Nov 1993 Posts: 10588
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Posted: Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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techno900,
I thought we were talking about student threats to teachers and school administrators. How does students selling narcotics fit in with what we we discussing? It doesn't. You're quickly losing ground here creating nonsense.
Regarding any student caught selling narcotics on school grounds, the offense would reported to the police, regardless of a student's ethnicity. The same would be true for students found with guns on school grounds. |
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