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Pardon me
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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 17742
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trump is known to have said, to more than one person who worked for him while he was in the White House, do something illegal, and if you get caught, I'll pardon you. Stone made it clear that he knew he would be pardoned if he kept his mouth shut.

Last edited by mac on Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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wsurfer



Joined: 17 Aug 2000
Posts: 1634

PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The pardon process is always controversial.

Trump manages to take it from controversial to downright sleazy!

Blackwater pardons => Eric Prince, Blackwater founder => Brother of Betsy DeVos.

The sleaze factor is unreal.

Few have challenged the original convictions, Erik Prince was one.

U.S. Military reports agreed on the excessive unprovoked response by Blackwater.
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vientomas



Joined: 25 Apr 2000
Posts: 2343

PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wsurfer wrote:
The pardon process is always controversial.

Trump manages to take it from controversial to downright sleazy!

Blackwater pardons => Eric Prince, Blackwater founder => Brother of Betsy DeVos.

The sleaze factor is unreal.

Few have challenged the original convictions, Erik Prince was one.

U.S. Military reports agreed on the excessive unprovoked response by Blackwater.


I wonder what the going rate for a pardon is these days? I can't imagine Trump is not receiving monetary compensation for his "benevolent" acts.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10588

PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We should keep in mind that Donald Trump isn't done with the clemencies and pardons. The whole thing stinks terribly, especially considering the people involved.

Nothing like giving justice the middle finger, and so much for his commitment to drain the swamp.
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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
Posts: 14838
Location: on earth

PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/some-gop-concede-trump-s-pardons-were-rotten-what-s-n1252414?cid=referral_taboolafeed


As some in GOP concede Trump's pardons were 'rotten,' what's next?


If Clinton's pardons were the subject of a thorough investigation, it'd be ridiculous to hold Trump's far more scandalous pardons to a lower standard.


Quote:
Looking over the list of pardons Donald Trump has issued since losing last month's election is a jarring experience. The president has effectively wielded his pardon power as a corrupt weapon, rewarding loyalists, completing cover-ups, undermining federal law enforcement, and doling out perverse favors to the politically connected.

The Republican has even allowed convicted murderers to go free, in part because a Fox News personality told him it'd be a good idea.

The pardons from Wednesday night -- the day before Christmas Eve -- were especially egregious, but there's no reason to assume they represent the last of the abuses. There have been rumors about other Trump insiders who are in contention for pardons, and they may yet receive their get-out-of-jail-free cards.

As we discussed last week, in the United States, there is -- or at least, was -- a process for those seeking presidential clemency. There are Justice Department officials who are responsible for reviewing cases, weighing the evidence and relevant details, and making recommendations based on merit. The point is to identify Americans most deserving of mercy and governmental benevolence. But in the Trump era, the pardon process isn't about righting wrongs; the process is itself wrong.

As Politico noted, even some Republicans are finding this tough to defend.

Sen. Pat Toomey on Sunday said President Donald Trump had gone too far with some of his presidential pardons. Speaking on "Fox News Sunday," the Pennsylvania Republican said that while the president had the right to pardon anyone, "I think it's a misuse of the power" to pardon people whose greatest claim to this special form of justice is a connection to the president.

"I mean, my goodness, we have tax fraud and bank fraud, witness tampering, obstruction of justice, but because they were close to the president they got pardoned," Toomey said. The retiring GOP senator added, "This is unfortunately reminiscent of the Marc Rich pardon by President Clinton. It is legal, it is constitutional, but I think it's a misuse of the power."

Similarly, Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.) issued a written statement last week, describing Trump's latest pardons as "rotten to the core." The Nebraskan added that "felons like [Paul] Manafort and [Roger] Stone" had "flagrantly and repeatedly violated the law and harmed Americans."

But it was Toomey's reference to Clinton's Marc Rich pardon that struck me as especially notable. There are certainly legitimate questions about the presidential action from 20 years ago, which were closely scrutinized after the Democratic president exited the White House.

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And therein lies the point: if Clinton's Rich pardon from 2001 was investigated by Congress and federal prosecutors -- a gentleman by the name of James Comey helped oversee a Justice Department examination, more than a decade before he led the FBI -- why wouldn't there be similar scrutiny of Trump's spectacularly more controversial pardon abuses in 2020?

And given that even some Senate Republicans believe Trump's "rotten" pardons went too far, shouldn't the investigations enjoy bipartisan support?

Just Security recently explained, 'President Donald Trump apparently holds the misguided belief that his pardon power is 'absolute.' But while the pardon power is expansive in scope, that power is nevertheless constrained by the Constitution and federal criminal laws, including anti-bribery and obstruction laws."

If Clinton's pardons were the subject of a thorough and lengthy investigation, it'd be ridiculous to hold Trump's far more scandalous pardons to a lower standard.


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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
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Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The corruption of Trump is exceeded by his cruelty.

Quote:
lex Busansky
Dec. 29, 2020 at 12:29 p.m. PST
Add to list
Alex Busansky, president of Impact Justice, was a lawyer in the Justice Department’s civil rights division.

Roger Stone, Paul Manafort, Charles Kushner, Stephanie Mohr. You’ve probably heard about President Trump’s odious pre-Christmas pardons for the first three — and nothing about Mohr, a former Prince George’s County police officer. But Mohr’s pardon — for violating a homeless man’s civil rights by unleashing her K-9 on him — is equally, if not more undeserving. Of all the acts to pardon in a year that witnessed the killing of George Floyd, it is the most insensitive and inflaming.

I know; I was part of the team at the Justice Department’s civil rights division that helped prosecute Mohr in 2001.

In the middle of the night on Sept. 21, 1995, a local Prince George’s County police burglary stakeout unit found two homeless men on the empty roof of a business, eating food they had found in the trash in Takoma Park, Md. Ordered down from the roof, Ricardo Mendez and his friend willingly climbed down. Lit by a police helicopter above and facing a brick wall, the two men were surrounded by police officers, some with guns drawn, and Mohr holding her German shepherd on a leash. Both men obeyed commands and stood facing the wall with their hands up.

It should have been over. It wasn’t.

A police sergeant later testified that he was approached by Mohr’s supervising officer who said, “Hey Sarge, we got a new dog. Mind if it gets a bite?” The sergeant gave consent, and Mohr set her dog to attack Mendez, an undocumented immigrant whose only crime was seeking a safe place to eat and sleep. Mohr testified that she was doing her job as trained, and the victim needed “only 10 stitches.”

Think about that: only 10 stitches. Mohr disregarded her training to give her dog a taste of flesh and blood.

This was no accident or split-second mistake. It was a willful and deliberate act of police brutality. It was also not Mohr’s first — and there was a pattern to the violence. Evidence at trial showed that Mohr had previously released her dog on a Black teenager sleeping in a hammock in his own backyard. She had threatened the relatives of a fugitive that she would let her dog attack their “black ass” if they did not tell her where he was. There were other incidents that the jury did not even learn about, including one in which Mohr put her dog into a trash dumpster to attack a man who had fled from police.
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swchandler



Joined: 08 Nov 1993
Posts: 10588

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why in the hell Donald Trump pardoned Mohr now is highly questionable, but the good news is that Mohr did serve 10 years in prison for her crime. I have to guess that her life after prison hasn't been that great and she was looking to lose the past.
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real-human



Joined: 02 Jul 2011
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Location: on earth

PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2021 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

seems a few more may need pardons, but if you receive a pardon your law license is history...

https://www.businessinsider.com/michigan-dems-disbar-pro-trump-lawyers-sidney-powell-lin-wood-2021-1?r=MX&IR=T


Michigan Democrats call for pro-Trump attorneys Sidney Powell and Lin Wood to be disbarred for spreading 'objectively false allegations'


Quote:
Attorneys working to overturn the 2020 presidential election should be disbarred and fined, said Michigan Democrats in a scathing court filing in Michigan on Tuesday.
Lawyers Sidney Powell, Lin Wood, and others, have filed "so many objectively false allegations" that they should be disciplined, said Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer.
"While the First Amendment may protect the right of political fanatics to spew their lies and unhinged conspiracy theories, it does not grant anyone a license to abuse our courts for purposes which are antithetical to our democracy and to our judicial system," they wrote in the filing.

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real-human



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

again you can only pardon for admitted criminal activities. So to be asking about pardoning oneself is an absolute admission of being a real criminal over serious matters.


President Trump has suggested to aides in recent weeks that he wants to pardon himself, according to two people with knowledge of the discussions.

Thursday, January 7, 2021 3:04 PM EST
Quote:

In several conversations since Election Day, Mr. Trump has told advisers that he is considering giving himself a pardon and, in other instances, asked whether he should and what the impact would be on him legally and politically, according to the two people.
It was not clear whether he has broached the topic since he incited his supporters on Wednesday to storm the Capitol in a mob attack.

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mac



Joined: 07 Mar 1999
Posts: 17742
Location: Berkeley, California

PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2021 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, he did signal that he would pardon those who broke laws at his behest...

Quote:
n up for the Guardian’s First Thing newsletter
Jenna Ryan, a Texas real estate broker who took a private jet to Washington to join the attack on the US Capitol, has pleaded with Donald Trump to pardon her after she was arrested by federal authorities.

After surrendering to the FBI on Friday, Ryan said: “We all deserve a pardon.”

“I’m facing a prison sentence,” she told CBS11 at her home. “I think I do not deserve that.”


Acting US defense secretary Christopher Miller says he 'can't wait' to leave his job
Read more
Turning to look into the camera, she said: “I would ask the president of the United States to give me a pardon.”

On Wednesday, Trump was impeached for inciting the attack on 6 January that left five people dead, including a police officer, and sent lawmakers fleeing for their lives.

Ryan said she had been “displaying my patriotism”, adding: “I listen to my president who told me to go to the Capitol.”

Ryan left a trove of information online. Court papers show she posted a picture of herself taking a private jet to Washington DC the day before the riot, subsequently posing on the steps of the Capitol and beside a window smashed as the pro-Trump mob broke in.
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